Apparently more than 1 million people have now signed a petition calling for the scrapping of planned road charges.

Given that unless road traffic is dramatically cut - immediately - then the future of the planet is at risk, what are these people actually voting for?

They are like turkeys - voting for Christmas !

You can get almost anyone to vote for anything if you slant the question correctly. Let's ask the question again - are you in favour of making yourself extinct?

The hilarious thing is that fuel duty would be scrapped. That means fuel would be about 65% cheaper than it is now (even with VAT still being charged). So anyone that could still afford to drive could buy a huge gas guzzling 4x4 or sports car instead of that supermini, no difference in running costs, we'd all pay the same.

Maybe the environmentalists and yourself should think about that before supporting this?

I`m not an enviromentalist and I`m glad someone else brought this subject up.
I use public transport, a bicycle and taxis purely because I cannot be bothered with the amount of traffic sat in rows going nowhere at all.
I hire a car if I need one and I will not sign that petition against congestion as something has to be done to prevent the UK from becoming the worlds biggest car park.
I have saved a lot of money since I sold my car as well, being self employed, I realise this is different to a lot of peoples situations that have to commute.
I like the bit about turkeys ITK, a turkey is not just for valentines day, but maybe a congestion/indigestion charge is.

Good Morning, Your Lordship*

You are assuming that the road charging plans will be the ONLY form of taxation. Fuel duty will increase (as another stealth tax) as will the cost of actually buying vehicles (as manufacturers will have to substantially increase prices - to combat falling sales - in order to maintain margin).

All in all, the combined effects of all these extra charges / taxes will hopefully drive (sorry about the pun) people off the roads !

(Of course, it also has a duel benefit. We would not be quite such an obese nation if people actually walked around a bit, would we?)

* I too an a Lord, you know! I slipped the Labour Party a few quid, but they've asked me to keep quiet about it during the enquiry !

best wishes



In The Know
(Never PC - but usually correct!)

Well I'm glad it all looks rosey for you people.

I agree that there are far too many cars on the road, I also agree that many people COULD walk, cycle or take public transport but don

Well, You're, I'm glad you got that off your chest!

Actually some very valid points. Throw in the legal/human rights problems and the solution appears to be...

We're in deep shit and it's getting deeper!

One solution:

Emigrate. Sad to think that the top solution to my problems is to leave the country where I was born, but it's true. Britain came 44th or somewhere silly in a poll of best Countries in the world to live. Over half of my old school mates have gone, France and Australia are popular.

Problem: I feel I should be around for my retired parents. They looked after me when I was young, I should do the same for them now they're old. I hope my kids will do the same, not that I can afford to have any.

Solution two:

The over-inflated cost of living in a City may be offset by the cost of owning a car. Of course Cities are already over-crowded and I would rather not live there.

Problem: How am I going to get to my parents to look after them without a car?

I can't move into their 1 bedroom bungalow.
They won't move at their age.

We're not suggesting that everyone gives up their cars - simply pointing out that there has to be a dramatic cut if we are to survive !

Moving abroad will not help - they are doomed too !

ITK, if you seriously think that a cut in the amount of cars on the UK roads is going to make a scrap of difference and that this is what the proposal is trying to achieve, you should start posting under the name, "Naive as F***"!

Lord Cox ...

So, we all just carry on as usual - in the certain knowledge that the planet will be destroyed?

Like I said .... it's just like turkeys voting for a trip to Bernard Matthews !

Jeez ITK, you

I don't think cutting emmissions will save the world (alone) - but I believe we have to make a start somewhere.

You on the other hand want to coninue to bury your head in the sand and hope that it will all go away !

Getting drivers to stop using their cars will never stop climate change. The government knows this, they actually don't want any drivers to give up driving, they simply want more money from drivers.

Mankind will not die out due to global warming, we will all be dead from nuclear war long before that. The joke is we will have all paid for our own nuclear deaths via the taxes paid for using our cars!

I was a FOE (frineds of the earth) and I couldnt belive how many morons thought that cars, planes, ships caused all these problems aobut global warming.
So I withdrew my memembership within 3 weeks I had enough cars are people lives.

It is a bunch crap cars only cause about 3% pollution planes about 2 % ships 1%. Cows Memphane 85 % so it is not us it s the cows.

Gordon Brown is just using it as an excuse to raise tax and do more stealth into people pockets.

If you want a cleaner air and save the planet get all the cows into a slaughterhouse.

There's some merit in both arguments (although I think Lord Cox could have been a little less personal in his...).

However, I don't think anyone (that is, anyone with at least half a brain), thinks that just by cutting fuel emissions in the UK, we're going to save the world from boiling.

The solution (and lets' face it, we DEFINITELY need one) can only be a dramatic cut in GLOBAL carbon emissions, and not just from peoples cars.

As a society, and I'm talking globally, we have to urgently begin examining the way in which we live our lives. This applies to all of us, and does not just mean getting the train to work occasionally.

To me, Lord Cox sums up perfectly the attitude of what I like to call the 'Flat-Earthers', quite a few of which are currently in The White House. These are the people, who refuse to accept the truth of the situation around them, much like the people who, 500 odd years ago, dismissed Christopher Columbus' assertions that The Earth was round.

Lord Cox: "If everyone in the world died tomorrow the world would still heat up, fact. There would still be global warming because the Earth moves in cycles. Gets hot, gets cold. We as a race probably account for 3% of that, big deal."

Now, who's being naive?

If everyone in the world died tomorrow the earth would still heat up. In that you are correct, but guess what..? When we're all dead there will be no more power stations, no jumbo jets, no cars, no excess fucking packaging, and no red-roses being flown half way around the world on bloody Valentines Day. There will also be no rising sea levels, no desertification of southern Europe and the much of the Amazon. The Polar Bears might have a chance of avoiding extinction. Bangladesh will not be consumed by the sea. We will not have the wars that will inevitably follow the mass migrations when whole nation's food and water sources are exhausted.

Yes, the earth's climate moves in cycles. But up until the beginning of the industrial revolution, these cycles were triggered by NATURAL changes to the global environment. Oh yes, and these cycles have usually been over a much longer period of time than we are currently experiencing.

FACT: If humans stopped pumping carbon to the atmosphere tomorrow, the rate of temperature increase would inevitably slow, and within 15-20 years would begin cooling again.

FACT: We are destroying our home and in the process, we may well cause our own extinction..

If we are to have any chance of avoiding the more 'nightmarish' scenarios of Global Warming, urgent action is required.

To my eye, the biggest challenge facing us all is persuading developing economies to curb their emissions. Our only hope is Business & Governments taking the long-view, rather than worrying about next year's balance sheet.

Adios,
Pete

Pete

Well said.

Now make a start - stop using your car!

<<< 85 % so it is not us it s the cows. >>>

I just KNEW that the Mad Farmers would have something to do with it!

Cheers ITK, but I've already done that.

Whilst driving home on the M25 10 months ago, my car's engine basically exploded. I decided then not to bother getting the car fixed - it would have cost me nearly

Lord Cox, I've just read your posts again, and I have to say that I am staggered by your obvious stupidity, as well as your alarming lack of understanding of the situation we all face.

Are you seriously trying to tell this noard that the whole Global Warming debate has been dreamt up by some shady consipracy, in order for The Man to make a shedload of cash?

Jeez, who's the work of art here...?

Make a sentence out of the following words...

OF YOUR DUDE HEAD ARSE OUT DUDE TAKE YOUR

Thanks, Pete - it's so nice to know that I'm not alone !

<<< In addition, I was becoming quite a lazy chap (driving to the shops when I could have walked in ten minutes, that type of thing...), and since I've ditched the motor, I've become a little less lazy, and a little bit fitter. >>>

You should get a Labrador (want to borrow mine for a couple of weeks?)