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TOPIC: A Constitutional Outrage
#192022
Barney

A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
Says Mr Speaker - about the scheduled prorogation

Parliament will be suspended in mid-September


Three senior ministers are getting the Queen's signature in Balmoral today

Boris is a very busy chap


In continued conflict with the EU, also

Whilst negotiating a massive trade deal with Trump



 
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#192024
Jo

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
Maybe a desperate thought, but can the Queen refuse?

Will be interesting to see what Jeremy Corbyn does now.
 
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#192025
hedda

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
it will all end in tears.
Mark my words.
 
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#192027
Barney

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
Wild condemnation from all sides now

From EU - and other countries - saying that democracy is threatened


And Corbyn has written to the Queen

Seeking an urgent meeting


Holidays are being cancelled

Utter uncertainty now rules...



 
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#192028
Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
And the pound has collapsed as anyone vacationing in Europe or America has discovered today.
 
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#192031
Barney

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
The Queen has signed the required document.

Boris' opponents all caught napping after a bank holiday weekend.

All done and dusted before lunchtime.

Corbyn and company - can only moan now.


 
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#192037
Barney

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 3 Days ago  
Queen Anne was the last monarch to refuse royal assent for an Act of Parliament, in 1707.

Against the will of her parliament - 'La Reyne le veult' was not allowed to be uttered.

Norman french for 'the Queen wishes it' - immediately making an act or bill to become law.

In the required procedure for prorogation, MPs will have to visit the House of Lords - and witness its robed members doff their caps, to them.


And much more - including the repeated quoting of the Norman phrase.


Which might well provide an opportunity for remainers, dissenters and others - to protest or show their extreme dissatisfaction with (what many think) the end of democracy...


 
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#192048
hedda

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 2 Days ago  
Doubt anyone has been caught napping and has always been aware of Boris' plans. He's too bloody obvious.

There was no way of stopping what he has done..just preparing for it

This is a high stakes game and Boris is playing for bust. Plenty having been saying he is gearing up for a GE which is the probable outcome.

It's a very odd time. You have the media hell bent on demonising Jeremy Corbyn including the right-wingers in his party and those who left.

Those who left?. Who they? Many of us said they were destined for oblivion and that may be sooner than they thought. But they are an example of how the largely right-wing media have been mendaciously crafting stories for the benefit of the richer classes...building up Chuku Whoever he Was and Crew and then dumping them when they show what lightweights they always were.

The next phase of The Boris Plot will expose Labour's Corbyn haters either for good or bad..such as Tom Watson who I reckon is headed for oblivion as well seeing he's been hell bent of self promotion but devoid of substance.

It's clear Corbyn has a very definite approach of not engaging in an endless bitch fest with his rivals and simply campaigning on an old fashion "meet and greet" the people. His rallies have been YUUGE and rarely reported (except in local media which can often be far more influential in deciding votes than the national media) not it means they are successful..whereas Boris Johnson's every single daily step long before he was anointed PM by ( 100K plus) a bunch of 16 year olds and doddery Tories has been breathlessly and endlessly reported including by the BBC.

These are fairly new tactics on either side so it's very difficult to know which will be successful.

The mass media lives in a bubble of it's own belief system whereby they seem to think all 60 Million Plus Brits breathlessly hang off every word they print or spout on the BBC etc and ignore how powerful the internet is.

A good example of this are the last 2 elections and note the figures were basically every single poll and media pundit were spouting balderdash about Jeremy Corbyn being destroyed:

2015 election with New Labour: Total Labour vote - 9,347,273 - 232 seats - 30.4% of the vote.

2017 election with Corbyn: Total Labour vote - 12,877,918 - 262 seats - 40% of the vote.


So just 2 years ago Corbyn won the highest ever Labour vote using the same tactics he is now using.

Of course most pundits write off that huge Labour Under Corbyn vote as though it were an anomaly and voters must have been too stupid to know what they wanted.

In the meantime of course the Faux Antisemitism campaign began. Will it have been effective? I say no, not that it means however Labour will win but they won't lose because of it- it would be for other reasons..(but in the meantime the tiny Jewish population- most who remained silent and allowed so-called community leaders to run a political and false campaign in their names- will pay a dear price for many years to come.)

So little has changed in 2 years with Jeremy Corbyn whose policies were eagerly accepted by 40% of the electorate just 2 years ago.

Of course everything now moves at such a rapid pace with a mendacious media who decides what is important..who knows what will happen.

Will the electorate accept a Prime Minister who was imposed upon them by a tiny handful of people and who hasn't had time to establish himself as the last one did?

Have enough people removed from Brexit to Remain that may switch votes away from a 'No Deal' Boris?

Have enough fallen out of love with Labour's incredibly reasonable policies that were standard even during Thatcher's nest years under Tories and Labour?

Is there a huge winning majority of voters out there still who are largely sick to death of the media imposing it's rubbish on them especially with an obvious chancer like Boris who shows little of the "sense" even Theresa May was able to project when she was given time to?

Will a large energized "youth vote" make a difference seeing they will be instantly affected under Brexit?

I don't know as my crystal ball is a bit clouded up at present.
 
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#192049
Barney

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 2 Days ago  
Ironic that that Norman french is still a part of the business of the Palace of Westminster.

Brought in by the Duke of Normandy (later designated William the Conqueror), after he took over Britain around 1066.

Only 20 years later he had completed the Great Survey (Doomsday Book) - essentially a wealth/tax investigation.


Also ironic - is, unlike the other conquerors we had (like the Romans who departed c300 AD, because of problems at home), the Normans never left us.

Much of the power and wealth in the UK remains in the hands of Norman families - albeit well integrated after a millennium.

Noteworthy too, that Norman castles still stand - like Windsor. And the lands acquired by Norman families is still held by their descendants.


Many historians say that the Normans just became us...



 
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#192050
Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 2 Days ago  
....Leader of the House Jacob Rees-Mogg, who was at the meeting with the Queen, said this Parliamentary session had been one of the longest in almost 400 years, so it was right to suspend it and start a new session.....


www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49504526



Talk and headlines make the action seem like Boris has appointed himself as a dictator and yet reading the BBC article puts it all in a difference light.

What will happen re BREXIT - well time will tell. But to who is right and who is wrong all confusing but I do not like at all Corbyn's approach when the majority voted for BREXIT thus a democratic decision and I see any action to continue to delay the voted decision and timetable as the undemocratic intent and action.

Sadly I wanted Corbyn to be the man who cared for fairness, democracy, justice, homelessness, NHS, schools and so on... but yes the slogan "....for the many ..." is great but now he is acting for the Corbyn. And all those other issues and dangerous people in labour like those on the side of false allegations and many other issues he had not dealt with and lead a clear path when it comes to really taking action, forcing clear direction. As they say actions speak louder than words *Certainly in this case).
 
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#192059
Randall

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 2 Days ago  
wjlmarsh wrote:
... the majority voted for BREXIT thus a democratic decision...

I'm with JK on this. Imagine an initial question: do you want to buy a car? Yes or No. Ok yes. How much do you want to spend? Diesel or petrol? How many seats? What colour? What make? What will you use the car for? How long do you want to keep it? What will you do if it goes wrong?

Yes, the leave vote prevailed. But the implications of leaving, and the terms under which the UK might leave the EU, are a distinct second stage of the issue. Political debate on the subject has been execrable, and here lies the lack of democracy, I think. I do wish politicians would get a fucking grip of Brexit and, instead of prancing around like ninnies, sort out some kind of plan. Then put the plan to another popular vote, or call a general election prompted by the issue.
 
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#192073
hedda

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 1 Day ago  
The majority voted to advise they wanted Brexit.

No government or MP is required to accept advise.

David Cameron said he would implement the result but then he left.

There have been two (unelected by general election) PMs since.

The hyperbole and fanatical claims Brexit must be implemented are just that.

Britain went to war and participated in the destruction of 2 countries recently and the killing of 100,000s of civilians on "advice" that was false.

No-one has been punished for it. Except the victims..refugees who have fled the places we blew up who are demonized because of what we did.

It would be very unwise to just accept "advise" as a reason to make the most monumental change in 100 years when the outcome is so uncertain.

The real problem: so many millions who voted Brexit who did so for a million different reasons which are entirely false...they believe Johnny Foreigner is taking their jobs, they believe a bunch of garlic munchers are imposing laws upon them..they seem to think they were at Dunkirk and that Dunkirk was some sort of war victory.

Nonetheless it is an absolutely fascinating time and we are now entering Harold Wilson's famous maxim.." a week is a long time in politics".

Videos are surfacing left right and centre of various Tories proclaiming Parliament should never by prorogued ( I keep think of The Pouges ! ) to avoid debate etc..nothing new there but..did Boris Johnson lie to HM The Queen in his reasons? Constitutional crisis indeed !

# Ken Clarke announced he would be happy for Jeremy Corbyn to be PM.
 
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#192081
Desmond Umbros

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 1 Day ago  
Hedda. Since when was there "New Labour" in 2015?😂 C'mon now ...
 
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#192086
hedda

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks, 1 Day ago  
Desmond Umbros wrote:
Hedda. Since when was there "New Labour" in 2015?😂 C'mon now ...

you don't think Ed Milliband was New Labour?
 
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#192110
PaulB

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 3 Weeks ago  
A lot of fuss over nothing.
When the conference season is taken into consideration, parliament is losing only 4 or 5 days.
 
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#192357
Barney

Re:A Constitutional Outrage 1 Week, 5 Days ago  
Barney wrote:
In the required procedure for prorogation, MPs will have to visit the House of Lords - and witness its robed members doff their caps, to them.


And much more - including the repeated quoting of the Norman phrase.



Then - 5 weeks more holidays.

For MPs and Peers.


All fully paid for...by us...


 
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