I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday walking into Cranleigh town/village centre in Surrey. Few shops only, however the vaping shop was open. Since when was vaping considered to be essential to people's lives. To add insult to injury the attendant wasn't wearing a mask. Its arguable that the butchers should open, large outbreaks have occurred in meat processing factories, and meat is available in supermarkets. I'm not a great advocate of lockdowns, Wales has had the most draconian restrictions, but now has the fastest rate of growth. However if we must do lockdowns we should do them properly, otherwise they will just be extended

robbiex wrote:
I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday walking into Cranleigh town/village centre in Surrey. Few shops only, however the vaping shop was open. Since when was vaping considered to be essential to people's lives. To add insult to injury the attendant wasn't wearing a mask. Its arguable that the butchers should open, large outbreaks have occurred in meat processing factories, and meat is available in supermarkets. I'm not a great advocate of lockdowns, Wales has had the most draconian restrictions, but now has the fastest rate of growth. However if we must do lockdowns we should do them properly, otherwise they will just be extended

How is being forced into a crowded supermarket more helpful than being a single customer in a butchers or greengrocers with an open door?

If people are addicted they cant just stop, so to them, it will be essential.
Round here during lockdown the vape shops had a desk across the doorway and I think you phoned in your order and collected it.

The vape shop is open for the same reason my local off licence is - we are an addicted nation. The Gov want us compliant, not testy and restless.

Make sure they have their booze, fags, broadband and reality TV shows. Pay them 80% of salary and let them grow slower and stupider while we try and dig our way out of the mess we have created, grab swathes of power back and make fortunes for our own kind in the process.

inews.co.uk/news/uk/shops-open-tier-4-ru...-covid-restrictions-

Looking into it it appears that they shouldn't be open and were breaking the law. However the police have decided not to prosecute covid crimes. I noticed that it was an asian gentlemen running this particular shop illegally. No doubt claiming the furlough money as well as continuing to operate. The same as the local londis shop, run by asians completely maskless, with a care free attitude to covid, and they wonder why they have higher rates of infection amongst the BAME community.

If everyone complied with the rules this virus would have died out within a couple of months, like in Taiwan

Wyot wrote:
The vape shop is open for the same reason my local off licence is - we are an addicted nation. The Gov want us compliant, not testy and restless.

Make sure they have their booze, fags, broadband and reality TV shows. Pay them 80% of salary and let them grow slower and stupider while we try and dig our way out of the mess we have created, grab swathes of power back and make fortunes for our own kind in the process.

The vape shop is open illegally, much like your off-licence. I haven't seen an off licence for years. People can get booze and vapes from the supermarket, so there is no excuse

robbiex wrote:
[quote]Wyot wrote:


The vape shop is open illegally, much like your off-licence. I haven't seen an off licence for years. People can get booze and vapes from the supermarket, so there is no excuse

I think my off licence gets away with it because they also sell milk and crisps!

I can't even follow what wanky rules are in place at the moment. But they won't do any good. We need to grow up in 2021 and learn to live with this the best we can.

robbiex wrote:
inews.co.uk/news/uk/shops-open-tier-4-ru...-covid-restrictions-

Looking into it it appears that they shouldn't be open and were breaking the law. However the police have decided not to prosecute covid crimes. I noticed that it was an asian gentlemen running this particular shop illegally. No doubt claiming the furlough money as well as continuing to operate. The same as the local londis shop, run by asians completely maskless, with a care free attitude to covid, and they wonder why they have higher rates of infection amongst the BAME community.

If everyone complied with the rules this virus would have died out within a couple of months, like in Taiwan

Your Londis staff are probably not entirely to blame for the higher covid rates.

Yes Honey. There is no evidence that BAME have higher infection rates (as opposed to death rates) nor that Londis staff are more irresponsible than other shop staff! Nor that people obeyed social distancing rules in Taiwan more than in the UK; or that this made any difference to anything (it is how they effectively quarantined those who were actually infected right at the start before a majority of the country were infected like here). But this is the whole trouble with this subject now. Facts dont matter, propaganda and feeling rule.

Honey wrote:
robbiex wrote:
inews.co.uk/news/uk/shops-open-tier-4-ru...-covid-restrictions-

Looking into it it appears that they shouldn't be open and were breaking the law. However the police have decided not to prosecute covid crimes. I noticed that it was an asian gentlemen running this particular shop illegally. No doubt claiming the furlough money as well as continuing to operate. The same as the local londis shop, run by asians completely maskless, with a care free attitude to covid, and they wonder why they have higher rates of infection amongst the BAME community.

If everyone complied with the rules this virus would have died out within a couple of months, like in Taiwan

Your Londis staff are probably not entirely to blame for the higher covid rates.

The masks are useless anyway, especially when you have to wear glasses no matter what mask I use my glasses get steamed and fogged up. If I put the mask just under my nose it's fine but then the mask is useless. I can't wear contacts either due to fact I'm allergic to them they make my eyes painful and feel like they are on fire. My 'local' vape is open because some of the staff are self employed couriers drivers also.

theredelephants.com/all-of-the-best-stud...-spread-of-covid-19/

www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/artic...forts-inclusive.html

Green Man wrote:
[quote]Honey wrote:


The masks are useless anyway

Always have been, funnily enough. Those that spout the Gov propaganda now about them, fail to explain how the same Gov advisors said masks weren't needed and didn't do anything earlier in the year. Despite no radical scientific breakthroughs they accept unquestioningly that masks are now effective.

Because they have been told so...

The government said that masks didn't make any difference because then we had a 2 metre social distancing rule, so that as long as you stay 2m away the masks will offer no more protection. However when we went to 1m+ mitigation the masks do offer some protection, stopping the larger droplets from been released. Also originally they didn't want us to wear masks because they didn't want them to be taken away from the NHS. Now we have larger supplies that is not an issue. Surgeons wear masks all the time, they are not doing it for fun.

Yes; when I mentioned this to Government (having bought a really good, tight, expensive mask in Feb; being in two vulnerable categories) they did a reverse ferret and said yes, don't buy a mask as they would all be needed as PPE by hospital staff.

Since Day One it's been obvious to all except the gullibles that masks might be a tiny bit of help (I reckon 2%) and to avoid a virus which is only lethal to a tiny percentage (which included me) wearing one made sense but, like mine, not silly paper things but tight fitting, triple carbon filter ones sprayed regularly with spirit.

robbiex wrote:
The government said that masks didn't make any difference because then we had a 2 metre social distancing rule, so that as long as you stay 2m away the masks will offer no more protection. However when we went to 1m+ mitigation the masks do offer some protection, stopping the larger droplets from been released. Also originally they didn't want us to wear masks because they didn't want them to be taken away from the NHS. Now we have larger supplies that is not an issue. Surgeons wear masks all the time, they are not doing it for fun.

The Gov did not empahsise 2 metres or hospital shortages at the time. The message was they don't protect anyone; and the basic ones don't: as recent studies have confirmed. Also as medics pointed out as this unfolded and they demanded and were provided with better kit.

So we are dealing with a Gov who will deliberately mislead us at every stage. A Gov who has openly accepted in a SAGE strategy doc that scaring us is a justified and desirable strategic aim.

What else are they misleading about...? What else might they be presenting in a certain way?

Could it be possible they are willing to terrify us in order to avoid the real issue of a massively undefunded nhs? That they built Nightingale hospitals without having any staff to work them? That they will allow the economy to flatline in order to try and save their sorry political hides because admitting mistakes is too much for them to do?

I have a tight fitting fully protective mask, and I am decontaminating my hands like billy-o, so I don't need to worry what shopkeepers are doing or if people have masks on or not.

(The exception being when nurses are breathing directly in my face with their masks tucked under their chins)

Wyot wrote:
robbiex wrote:
The government said that masks didn't make any difference because then we had a 2 metre social distancing rule, so that as long as you stay 2m away the masks will offer no more protection. However when we went to 1m+ mitigation the masks do offer some protection, stopping the larger droplets from been released. Also originally they didn't want us to wear masks because they didn't want them to be taken away from the NHS. Now we have larger supplies that is not an issue. Surgeons wear masks all the time, they are not doing it for fun.

The Gov did not empahsise 2 metres or hospital shortages at the time. The message was they don't protect anyone; and the basic ones don't: as recent studies have confirmed. Also as medics pointed out as this unfolded and they demanded and were provided with better kit.

So we are dealing with a Gov who will deliberately mislead us at every stage. A Gov who has openly accepted in a SAGE strategy doc that scaring us is a justified and desirable strategic aim.

What else are they misleading about...? What else might they be presenting in a certain way?

Could it be possible they are willing to terrify us in order to avoid the real issue of a massively undefunded nhs? That they built Nightingale hospitals without having any staff to work them? That they will allow the economy to flatline in order to try and save their sorry political hides because admitting mistakes is too much for them to do?

I read something the other day that said that the government have actually sold off the equipment in the Nightingale "hospitals", but now I cant find it again.
Does anyone know about this? It might well be nonsense of course.