Judge Alison Nathan seems to have ruled repeatedly against Ghislaine Maxwell, the latest decision being to allow prosecutors to refer to accusers as “victims” in the trial and to allow accusers to remain anonymous in order to protect them from harassment from the media and others.

Ghislaine Maxwell loses key rulings ahead of trial for Jeffrey Epstein sex crime case

Ghislaine Maxwell Accusers Can Use Pseudonyms, Judge Rules as Maxwell Maintains Innocence

Lots of people are gloating under the articles about this on Facebook (they'd probably be right at the front cheering on a public execution):

Ghislaine Maxwell forced to crawl 'on her hands and knees' to get in prison van on way to court

It's hard to see how she can get a fair trial or face a jury uncontaminated by media or online chatter.

I rewatched a couple of 60 Minutes reports about the Epstein/Maxwell case on YouTube last night ("Exposing Jeffrey Epstein's international sex trafficking ring" and "Inside the wicked saga of Jeffrey Epstein: the arrest of Ghislaine Maxwell") and even allowing for biased and inaccurate reporting do have to wonder how Ghislaine Maxwell, if she was Epstein's girlfriend and/or managing his homes and recruiting staff, can claim not to have known that he had a sexual interest in young and possibly underage girls (why else would he have wanted them to massage him rather than just employ a regular masseur/masseuse?) and for what purpose she thought she was bringing them into his orbit, if she in fact did that.

In the longer report, Epstein accuser Courtney Wild, who has apparently served time in jail for drug offences and got her name on a crime bill (One of Jeffrey Epstein’s victims now has her name on a crime bill in Congress), said that she had recruited around 50 girls and been paid for doing so. In the interviews I've seen of the Prince Andrew accuser, I haven't noticed her being asked or volunteering any information of that kind, other than claiming that she'd been asked when she went on her trip to Thailand to bring back a girl. The media do seem to want to treat her very gently, perhaps so that they don't kill the golden goose.

Maxwell has been treated atrociously and denied a fair trial withy her endless incarceration.

The entire Epstein saga is cone of the biggest media beat-ups of the century rivaling the British Savile sensation.

(Savile's reputation as Britain's worst offender may now be eclipsed by the claims a new accused may have fiddled with 100s of corpses)

He wasn't a "pedophile" but obviously had a penchant for late teen girls.

Unsavory at best but they were basically opportunist prostitutes. He obviously broke US state laws which is sensationally called "sex trafficking" painting a ridiculous image of evil cohesion when flying a paid companion across State lines for perhaps a holiday.

We could debate forever the manner in which the wealthy use their influence to gain what they want..not sure how many would come out smelling of roses.

Like the UK, the USA still suffers from a Puritan streak of moral conservatism lacking in most of Europe.

If Epstein's taste in young flesh is as evil as painted..what can we say about The Sun newspaper and Rupert Murdoch's higly successful introduction of Page 3 in 1970 where readers were encourage to ogle over topless lasses like "Lucy from Warwick" ..ages often lower than Epstein's "sex trafficked" ..one even 15 years old.

Millions of Brits bought The Sun and Page 3 "topless birds" photos were pinned up walls everywhere- until dropped around 2005..many of these photos..if Sid Bloggs still has one on his kitchen wall would legally be considered "child pornography" or "child abuse" images today and land you in jail.

I reckon there must have been over 10,000 Page 3 "victims" over the decades. Sex trafficking?

The Epstein matter is a media created sensation. Obviously there was a lot more to his mysterious life than we may ever be told.

Maxwell should have moved to France as she had French citizenship and could not have been extradited. I cannot see - on her current treatment- how she will receive a fair trial in a US court.


A court in the UK or Australia would possibly dismiss the charges as it could be claimed it would be impossible for her to receive a fair trial after the mountains of adverse publicity.

I think you make excellent points. There does seem to be a lot of hypocrisy around.

Have just found the Twitter account and website below, courtesy of the Guardian article below:

twitter.com/RealGhislaine ("Developed & maintained by Ghislaine Maxwell’s brothers & sisters. We will continue to fight on behalf of our beloved sister. Follow us for the truth & updates.")

www.realghislaine.com/ ("This website has been developed and is maintained by brothers, sisters, family & friends of Ghislaine Maxwell, the people who have known the real Ghislaine all her life, not the fictional one-dimensional character created by the media.")

Satire really has left the building when we’re asked to be kind to Ghislaine Maxwell

There's also a "Real Ghislaine" YouTube channel.

Here are letters sent to the judge in support of Ghislaine Maxwell (linked in the answer to "Who is Ghislaine?" on the FAQs page of the "Real Ghislaine" website).

Page 21 is particularly interesting, as it addresses the allegation that she was seeking to evade justice. I remember thinking when the FBI spokesman said she'd "slithered away" that it seemed an inappropriately emotive statement from an organisation that one would expect to investigate impartially.

Thank you Jo; yes this blatant agenda is one of the banes of global justice these days. Quite simply any decent Judge should ban any further involvement by that person or organisation. Like use of the word "victim". Like media coverage - "paedophile" misused. Balance in society has disappeared mainly because taking one side makes a "better story".

Incredible that this is allowed. A three-part "docuseries" called "Chasing Ghislaine" is apparently being broadcast on the discovery+ channel at the time of the trial. Wonder if this is in the hope that jurors will see it or hear about it.

Jeffrey Epstein said Ghislaine Maxwell ‘is the best at what I need’: new doc

Her tale in today's Mail.

The FBI are notorious for exploiting prosecutions in the media.

Not a scintilla of proof has been presented that she was "on the run" and the FBI never announced publicly they wanted to interview her.

This also indicates their lack of interest in Prince Andrew seeing they love to exaggerate..have publicly announced they are not investigating him.

Anything we can do, the yanks will do bigger. America has taken "Savile" and applied the hysterical shreiking "#mememetoo" and can come up with Celebrity Witch Trials to show the world once and for all it leads us all in the hysterical, the preposterous and the ugly.

Ghislaine Maxwell will be burnt at the stake due to her knowing Epstein, the now-dead "paedo" who wasn't actually a paedo.

R.Kelly and Ron Jeremy will be each sentenced to a million billion years in the penetentiary, narrowly escaping the good ol' electric chair, with the bail money set at a billion trillion dollars, and eventually US courts will just exist on YouTube documentaries and the like with verdict decided by a rigged poll on US-owned social media.

Meanwhile, the world will salivate over these Celebrity Witch Trials online whilst Yankee Venture Capital companies "invest" in our thriving businesses before stripping them to bare bones a year or tWhwo later, the new form of imperialist conquering.

What a truly appalling ghastly nation.

I think "cruel and unusual punishment" definitely applies to Maxwell.

She has been incarcerated without a speedy trial and is being drowned by the weight of highly prejudicial media campaigns, most just speculation and exaggerations of the Epstein's allegations.

Jo wrote:
Will Ghislaine Maxwell get a fair trial? She should not be punished for Epstein's crimes

Not sure link works but I assume this is the article:

unherd.com/2021/11/will-ghislaine-maxwell-get-a-fair-trial/

I've been watching a few Germaine Greer YouTube interviews. She rails against the @MeToo movement saying how appalling it is that people accepted money fro alleged assault and then years later decided to speak up (after time statutes have lapsed).

Great..I can't stand Rose McGowan and dills like Oprah who promote this stuff.

Greer is my favoutire "feminist" mainly because she attacks today's FemiNazis and despairs that they got it all wrong.

Even to the point of lambasting women who want to be equal to men basically saying why on Earth would they want to when men have so many problems and whoever said male working conditions are ideal?.

## she talks very matter of fact about her own brutal rape as a teenager and scoffs at the notion you cannot recover from sex assault as it's not the worst crime.

### I've simply hated the meme that has existed now for some decades (as a rape "survivor"..loathe that word)..that sex assault and rape means "your life has been rooned" promoted by unthinking "professionals", the media and so on.

What a horrible message to send to future rape victims.. "your life has now been ruined and there is no recovery". So vicious, so nasty.

I watched a cop on the news recently after a child porn / abuse images bust..stating "every time someone views these pictures the victim is assaulted all over again".

I pondered..today any image is basically sent all over the world via the internet & most especially porn of all types. It possibly never ever disappears and will be in someone's hands..maybe 1000s..forever.

So this cop was basically telling some child (or adult) porn victim that there maybe 1000s around the world are at this very moment viewing a photo of you and you are being abused and will be for decades to come..the rest of your life!

What a shocking, thoughtless message to give victims!

### The one thing I can identify with genuine victims is the notion you are partly to blame for your predicament..you shouldn't have gone out that night, should have dressed differently, acted differently and so on.

This goes to the heart of the Epstein and Maxwell allegations.

Young women (they were not children) were seduced by the thought of money and sold their bodies. This happens every day of the year. Newspapers are full of articles about celebrities and their multi-million £ homes, their expensive fast cars, lifestyles etc. etc..promoting envy.

Young people are constantly told that their worth is connected to wealth which few will attain. 1000s will queue up to give some creepy billionaire a "rub & tug" if they get $1000 for it.

Yes, that's the article. The link I posted still works for me (from the Real Ghislaine website).

I think you make excellent points. Perhaps the argument that lives have been completely ruined goes along with maximising a compensation payout.

So much about the Epstein/Maxwell allegations seems to be about money. Has the media ever asked an accuser how much they were paid and for what? If they have, I've missed it.

Another recent article, from the Telegraph, posted on the Real Ghislaine website:

Ghislaine Maxwell’s prison treatment worse than ‘a terrorist on death row’, says her family

Ghislaine Maxwell’s family has filed a legal claim with the United Nations to investigate the US legal system over her “arbitrary detention” and “dehumanising” treatment, claiming it is worse than “a terrorist on death row”.

Lawyers for Ms Maxwell’s six siblings filed a 22-page complaint with the UN on Tuesday, calling for her immediate release on the eve of her trial for alleged child sex abuse and trafficking crimes.

The legal case accuses US prosecuting authorities of helping to “demonize” Ms Maxwell, 59, by staging a “melodramatic press conference” following her arrest last year, so that “she was and remains treated as guilty even though ... she has still not been tried”.

...

Sarah Ransome, an Epstein/Maxwell accuser, who has been filmed outside the Maxwell trial courthouse dressed in red, has a book out and has being doing the rounds of the US media, judging from interviews with her on YouTube. She claims that Epstein raped her daily for nine months and threatened to kill her and her family if she didn't do what he wanted, reported him or tried to escape. She apparently had done "sex work" before and after her involvement with him and was a drug user. In her interview with the women on The View she says that the strongest response to her story, which Whoopie Goldberg describes as "powerful", is "I believe you".

A Jeffrey Epstein accuser shares scathing allegations in a new memoir: ‘My book is my day in court’

"By the time she arrived in New York, she had already supported herself as a sex worker."

"I want Ghislaine behind bars for the rest of her life"

"When she escaped Epstein in 2007, she turned to sex work again…"

Media coverage of prosecution arguments: bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla

Media coverage of defence arguments: bla

The defence appears to have rested its case very quickly, with Ghislaine Maxwell stating that she won't be taking the stand as she says that the prosecution have failed to prove her guilt beyond reasonable doubt. The defence have apparently called 9 witnesses rather than the 35 they originally intended but what they said is unknown, apart from one referred to by the BBC, as there appears to be no media coverage about it.

Ms Maxwell's defence team meanwhile complained on Friday that they needed more time to gather their witnesses.

"We are flying people across the country, across the pond, our client's life is on the line, and we are given only a half a day to put on a witness," said attorney Laura Menninger.

Judge Alison Nathan rebuked the lawyers for not having their witnesses ready and refused to delay the trial.

"I have a rule, you have your next witness or you rest," she said.

A former girlfriend of Epstein - Eva Andersson-Dubin - also testified for the defence on Friday.

A former physician and Miss Sweden winner, she said she had dated Epstein on and off from 1983 to 1991 and that her children called him "Uncle Jeff".

She denied involvement in group sexual encounters with a Maxwell accuser who testified last week.

But when pressed by prosecutors about the extent of her memory, she said: "I can't remember the past... sometimes I can't remember what happened a month ago." She said it was because of a health issue.

www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-59703611

Jo wrote:
Sarah Ransome, an Epstein/Maxwell accuser, who has been filmed outside the Maxwell trial courthouse dressed in red, has a book out and has being doing the rounds of the US media, judging from interviews with her on YouTube. She claims that Epstein raped her daily for nine months and threatened to kill her and her family if she didn't do what he wanted, reported him or tried to escape. She apparently had done "sex work" before and after her involvement with him and was a drug user. In her interview with the women on The View she says that the strongest response to her story, which Whoopie Goldberg describes as "powerful", is "I believe you".

A Jeffrey Epstein accuser shares scathing allegations in a new memoir: ‘My book is my day in court’

"By the time she arrived in New York, she had already supported herself as a sex worker."

"I want Ghislaine behind bars for the rest of her life"

"When she escaped Epstein in 2007, she turned to sex work again…"

The Epstein Affair is the USA's Savile moment.

Recall how anyone daring, daring to speak positively about Savile were shot down in flames and basically silenced under threat of Death By 1000 Tabloid Tales.

Except when he first died of course ..dear old Sir Jimmy has passed away...the Man With a Heart of Gold.

Witness how the author of "Jimmy Had a Heart of Gold" turned on sixpence and authored a book when the "scandal " hit , that now he was a monster.

My own small part when I heard a respected ABC radio presenter in Oz state he would have that author on his afternoon show and I called him and requested he question him about his "Heart of Gold" claim just after Savile died.

The response: how dare I tell him how to interview, what right did I have ringing him and the call terminated.

Needless to say, Dan Davies was given a 20 minute dream interview (nary a mention of Heart of Gold) on the National Broadcaster by one of the countries most respected broadcasters (since deceased)

# I wonder how many sales his book received in Australia with nearly 1 million Brits in the country..most brought up on a diet of Jimmy Savile.?

I doubt anyone in the MSM writing anything positive about Ghislaine Maxwell would survive in the US media.
## I should of course loathe her. When her father Robert Maxwell owned the Mirror group I was set for a high paying job in New York when he decided to move into US newspapers..but it all collapsed.

She has been treated atrociously and even a usual reasonable person like Whoopie Goldberg joins in the Chorus Line (out of fear?)

Why haven't all the names of these high profile people, Andrew Neil, Bill Clinton etc etc etc who flew on his plane (who wouldn't jump at a free flight on a private luxury 727?)been called to say the obvious..it was just a bloody free flight?


Difficult to know how all this will end.Especially when you are not in the court. Witness how Bill Cosby had his conviction over-turned when, no matter what the truth is- he should not have been tried at all because of legal; technicalities.

hedda wrote:
[quote]Jo wrote:


Why haven't all the names of these high profile people, Andrew Neil, Bill Clinton etc etc etc who flew on his plane (who wouldn't jump at a free flight on a private luxury 727?)been called to say the obvious..it was just a bloody free flight?



Why indeed Hedda?