It is hard to say which claims are true and which false; I suspect, as in most cases, the majority have a grain of truth and a lot of exaggeration because it makes a better story. Memory colours up experiences but so do greed, a desire for sympathy or fame, media attention and the dozens of other influences. Often men and women did find others attractive. It may be hard to believe in 2017 but, in years gone by, some people actually tried to get off with other people. Disgraceful, we all now agree, but way back then, in the mists of time, this was considered acceptable; just as rejecting advances, usually politely, sometimes forcefully, was allowed. In the gay world, especially, some took terrible offence. "You looking at me mate?" was heard echoing across bars and clubs. No; not everyone was innocent. No; not everyone was guilty. Yes; back then, we were a less superficial species. Believe it or not, conversations could be longer than 140 characters once and friends were sometimes people one had actually met.

JK2006 wrote:
It may be hard to believe in 2017 but, in years gone by, some people actually tried to get off with other people. Disgraceful, we all now agree, but way back then, in the mists of time, this was considered acceptable;

It was never considered acceptable to take a 14 year old to bed.

you can be so sensible and spot on at times JK.

One day you will take me for a ride in your Isle of Man registered Gulfstream jet with the gold plumbing.

Spacey should just move to France or Italy where more sex is not such a hangup and he would have a great career.

Very sad to hear Netflix have cancelled his Gore Vidal film..I reckon he is a superb actor.
But they're starting on Vidal now..

Spacey is being replaced - in the movie All the Money in the World - by Christopher Plummer, taking the J Paul Getty part.

The Ridley Scott movie will be released on schedule and shown on December 22nd.

Surprising, considering that the moved has already been completed - as all the scenes Spacey appeared in will have to be reshot.


Incidentally, the new Fredie Mercury movie is currently being filmed in Esher!

In The Know wrote:
JK2006 wrote:
It may be hard to believe in 2017 but, in years gone by, some people actually tried to get off with other people. Disgraceful, we all now agree, but way back then, in the mists of time, this was considered acceptable;

It was never considered acceptable to take a 14 year old to bed.


'Never' is a long time, but it was just over 100 years ago when British girls could get married at 11. Boys had to wait until they were 14, to give them time to find work and a place to live.

Just a few years ago, there was talk of lowering the age of consent to 14; possibly because so many teenagers were doing it anyway, regardless.
Laws often change, but human nature does not.

What does bother me, re Kevin Spacey, is the way he has been labelled at guilty without trial.
A different kind of human weakness.

Spot on Paul; that is the truly frightening thing and it is the Presumption of Guilt in full gear - these days we are all so busy, so superficial and so tabloid that we don't have time, energy or desire to think deeply, give time for discussion or investigation or waste our brain cells for anything other than slogans and tabloid headlines.

Kevin Spacey could have arranged an interview with some sympathetic journalist to tell the world about what sounds like a terribly miserable upbringing before his brother did. The rumours seem to have been around for years. Becoming a celebrity victim would have given him instant protection from the barbs of public opinion. After all, victims cannot be abusers and abusers can never be victims. I get the feeling though that keeping his inner world and soul intact is more important to him than seeking and obtaining sanctuary in perpetual victim status.

www.foxnews.com/story/2004/04/28/kevin-s...secrets-are-out.html

PaulB wrote:
In The Know wrote:
JK2006 wrote:
It may be hard to believe in 2017 but, in years gone by, some people actually tried to get off with other people. Disgraceful, we all now agree, but way back then, in the mists of time, this was considered acceptable;

It was never considered acceptable to take a 14 year old to bed.


'Never' is a long time, but it was just over 100 years ago when British girls could get married at 11. Boys had to wait until they were 14, to give them time to find work and a place to live.

Just a few years ago, there was talk of lowering the age of consent to 14; possibly because so many teenagers were doing it anyway, regardless.
Laws often change, but human nature does not.

What does bother me, re Kevin Spacey, is the way he has been labelled at guilty without trial.
A different kind of human weakness.

I'd like to add that that's just the British perspective. In the USA, where these alleged events occurred, minors can get married in all states with parental approval, or parental plus judicial approval. 25 states have no lower age limit for marriage with parental and judicial approval.

200 000 American minors have married in the past 15 years. The youngest examples were three 10 year old girls. They married men of 24, 25 and 31 in Tennessee in 2001. The youngest groom was 11 and married a 27 year old woman, also in Tennessee.

A major factor is religious custom, which is still a powerful influence in some regions of the USA. There are also strong constitutional protections for religious practice, which of course includes various marriage customs. Minor marriage is also almost exclusively a rural practice among the poor. It's sad that Americans have to marry off their children because they are too much of an economic burden. However, none of us can see inside another couple's marriage. These unusual pairings may well work out happily, just as "normal" marriages often end up badly.

Regarding Kevin Spacey specifically, let's consider what he is actually accused of. He tried it on with a (willing?) young lad at a presumably adult party. It may not have been apparent to Mr Spacey that the object of his affection was 14 because 1) people don't have their age in neon lights on their forehead and 2) one assumes that attendees at an adult gathering will be adults.

Randall wrote:
200 000 American minors have married in the past 15 years. The youngest examples were three 10 year old girls. They married men of 24, 25 and 31 in Tennessee in 2001. The youngest groom was 11 and married a 27 year old woman, also in Tennessee.

Do you understand the subject matter?

these are NOT people getting married with consent by BOTH parties ... this was an alleged homosexual sex attack !

In The Know wrote:


Do you understand the subject matter?


Did you read my last paragraph??

Sorry if that's too much for you to absorb all in one sitting.

Not very sorry though.

The "latest" I was alluding to is the journalist who has revealed her 18 year old son was approached by Kevin; tut tut wicked and disgraceful but she'll get some commissions out of it.

While on the subject, having veered away from Mr Spacey, the youngest British couple which I know of were Richard of Shrewsbury and Ann Mowbray, married in 1478. He was 4 and she was 5.
It was a political marriage, and it's doubtful that they had sex. He was widowed 3 years later.

Meanwhile, back on to the subject of Kevin Spacey. If he is cleared of wrong doing, I wonder how many millions he will be able to claim from Ridley Scott. There's bound to be a lawyer, chomping at the bit and shaving pencils somewhere off screen, waiting.

Randall wrote:

Did you read my last paragraph??.

No I didn't - too long and rambling (and nothing to do with the topic)

Also ...read enough of your posts to know how much of an apologist you are.

In The Know wrote:
Randall wrote:
200 000 American minors have married in the past 15 years. The youngest examples were three 10 year old girls. They married men of 24, 25 and 31 in Tennessee in 2001. The youngest groom was 11 and married a 27 year old woman, also in Tennessee.

Do you understand the subject matter?

these are NOT people getting married with consent by BOTH parties ... this was an alleged homosexual sex attack !

Whatever the stupid law says, a ten year old cant give consent.

In The Know wrote:
Randall wrote:

Did you read my last paragraph??.

No I didn't - too long and rambling (and nothing to do with the topic)

Also ...read enough of your posts to know how much of an apologist you are.

Ah, classic ITK. Never let facts and information cloud your views.

YOU asserted that it has never been acceptable to take a 14 year old to bed. My post demonstrated that it's legally acceptable in Kevin Spacey's home country, right now and in thousands of cases.

honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:

Whatever the stupid law says, a ten year old cant give consent.

Quite right, honey!

Its typical paedo predator MO to try and blame the victim.

And it is typical loony policy to pretend people are saying something they didn't say. In 2001 I was not allowed to say I felt, as a bi sexual male, that it had been absurd for the genders to have different ages of consent. This was considered advocating under age sex which, of course, it wasn't but loonies specialise in rewriting statements to justify their loony attitudes!

Tell us more about this; interesting.

honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:

Whatever the stupid law says, a ten year old cant give consent.

...in your opinion. Some cultures and jurisdictions (not many, admittedly) think otherwise. Remember that there are many in the world who would say that an under 18 year-old could never give sexual consent. They are aghast at institutionalised paedophilia in nations like Great Britain where one can have sex with 16 and 17 year olds.

I don't have a view on which culture or set of laws is right or wrong: I can only say how well it accords with my own preferences and ethical ideas. But I do think societies are allowed to organise themselves as they see fit, and not according to what you or ITK or any other outsider prefers.

Randall wrote:
and not according to what you or ITK or any other outsider prefers.

... which is why most societies jail paedos !