in some ways I agree with ITK : there is a growing substantial class now into their 2nd and 3rd generation who are totally reliant on government handouts.

they are unemployed ( one job going for every 3/4) and probably unemployable.

Unlike ITK I believe it's deliberate- he sees it as self imposed ( a typical British puritan blame game and variation on the 'pull yourself up..bootstraps etc").

If you create this huge class of unemployed in the millions you send a message to workers- don't ask for too much, more pay, more holidays etc etc...stay in your place.

The wealth of the western countries is staggering..UK is about the 3rd richest place on the earth. It can easily sustain this underclass through taxation. Corporations avoid hundreds of billions of pounds in taxation in just one year...more than the entire dole fiddles that has ever happened in history.

But the general public must be continually fed a diet of hate towards this new sub-class...easy to do as they aren't very likeable...to keep the entire charade going.

these are the facts : Heath, Tony Blair, Margaret Thatcher, Borown , Major, Cameron and all before them and after did not give Britain the following...it was done by unions battling to the death to finally get politicians to grant these 'privileges:

Your Weekends Your 8 hour work day, NHS,All breaks at work, including your lunch breaks Paid Annual Leave Paid Sick leave Overtime pay Social Security Minimum wage Collective bargaining Anti employer discrimination laws Child labour laws Occupational Safety & Health laws 38-hour work week Workers’ compensation Unemployment insurance Pensions Workplace safety standards and regulations Employer health care insurance Collective bargaining rights for employees Wrongful termination laws Sexual harassment laws Disability financial support Holiday pay Privacy rights Pregnancy and parental leave Military leave The right to strike Public education for children Men and women paid equally for the same amount of work Laws ending sweatshops, safe trains, safe cars and buses etc etc... and more...much much more.


all these fought for benefits impact beneficially upon everyone in every class.

comrade hedda wrote:
in some ways I agree with ITK : there is a growing substantial class now into their 2nd and 3rd generation who are totally reliant on government handouts.

they are unemployed ( one job going for every 3/4) and probably unemployable.

Unlike ITK I believe it's deliberate- he sees it as self imposed ( a typical British puritan blame game and variation on the 'pull yourself up..bootstraps etc").

Example - Derby Council (loony of course) plans to pay 1000 employees a "living wage" ... how are they going to afford it?

Make 350 other workers redundant !

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-25650741

all these fought for benefits impact beneficially upon everyone in every class.
...... and usually put people out of jobs as the price of goods is now unaffordable (and are much cheaper bought overseas).

Ask your loony friends - they all shop in Primark !!!!!

That did wonders for the clothing workers of Lancashire, did it not ???

Its probably a bit of both. It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

ITK'S grasp on economics :

Well done Hedda. MPs can have their expenses and pay rise, BBC staff can have their bonuses, Bankers can have the lot, footballers get 900k to 250k a week.

hedda wrote:
ITK'S grasp on economics :


Just simple economics, hedda !

Every time the "workers" put up their price, the cost of the goods increases and people look elsewhere for cheaper goods.

This is exacerbated when even the "workers" themselves shun their own goods and ALSO buy cheaper goods elsewhere (Primark !)
Every time the miners got a pay increase they went out and bought Datsun cars LOL !

Even primary school children can understand that !!!!

comrade hedda wrote:
Your Weekends Your 8 hour work day, NHS,All breaks at work, including your lunch breaks Paid Annual Leave Paid Sick leave Overtime pay Social Security Minimum wage Collective bargaining Anti employer discrimination laws Child labour laws Occupational Safety & Health laws 38-hour work week Workers’ compensation Unemployment insurance Pensions Workplace safety standards and regulations Employer health care insurance Collective bargaining rights for employees Wrongful termination laws Sexual harassment laws Disability financial support Holiday pay Privacy rights Pregnancy and parental leave Military leave The right to strike Public education for children Men and women paid equally for the same amount of work Laws ending sweatshops, safe trains, safe cars and buses etc etc... and more...much much more.

No wonder nothing ever gets manufactured (let alone sold) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why would anyone want to invest (and risk their money) here ?

honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

How can we "engineer" huge swathes of people that are unemployable?

Did we force them not to read and write?
Do we prevent them from applying for jobs?
Do we reject ideal candidates, just "to punish them"?

Read the comments of the Morrisons boss - then you'll see why most firms wont have them at any price. (These firms are businesses - not social services).

The cream will always rise to the top.
People will pay (well) for skills in demand

Miners deserved Datsun cars, bankers have limos.

In The Know wrote:
hedda wrote:
ITK'S grasp on economics :


Just simple economics, hedda !

Every time the "workers" put up their price, the cost of the goods increases and people look elsewhere for cheaper goods.

This is exacerbated when even the "workers" themselves shun their own goods and ALSO buy cheaper goods elsewhere (Primark !)
Every time the miners got a pay increase they went out and bought Datsun cars LOL !

Even primary school children can understand that !!!!

Funny enough when they introduced the minimum wage,inflation continued to fall.

In The Know wrote:
honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

How can we "engineer" huge swathes of people that are unemployable?

Did we force them not to read and write?
Do we prevent them from applying for jobs?
Do we reject ideal candidates, just "to punish them"?

Read the comments of the Morrisons boss - then you'll see why most firms wont have them at any price. (These firms are businesses - not social services).

The cream will always rise to the top.
People will pay (well) for skills in demand

How's the amnesia ITK?
Did you forget all those 'pushed' onto sickness type benefits during your glorious fuhrer's reign?
Nothing like 'out of site,out of mind' to massage the unemployment figures.

And talking of education,my sister at a senior school in an inner city tells me British kids really struggle to advance,as a lot of the teacher's time is spent trying to help the foreign kids keep up.

Oh and Morrisons is useless,worst service of any of the supermarkets,I live next door to one,my friend works in one in Kendal,I used to live near the head office...if they can't get their own business to work well,then blame the staff they really are a bunch of idiots.
The same local people make ASDA et al a pleasure to shop in,Morrisons cut corners,have higher prices,then like to pass the buck....oh and just been into the Gibraltar branch,so many of the goods mislabeled it was a joke trying to work out prices!..
...Go on Hedda,your turn

In The Know wrote:
honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

How can we "engineer" huge swathes of people that are unemployable?

Did we force them not to read and write?
Do we prevent them from applying for jobs?
Do we reject ideal candidates, just "to punish them"?

Read the comments of the Morrisons boss - then you'll see why most firms wont have them at any price. (These firms are businesses - not social services).

The cream will always rise to the top.
People will pay (well) for skills in demand

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2538260...el-dumbed-exams.html

Pattaya wrote:
In The Know wrote:
honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

How can we "engineer" huge swathes of people that are unemployable?

Did we force them not to read and write?
Do we prevent them from applying for jobs?
Do we reject ideal candidates, just "to punish them"?

Read the comments of the Morrisons boss - then you'll see why most firms wont have them at any price. (These firms are businesses - not social services).

The cream will always rise to the top.
People will pay (well) for skills in demand

How's the amnesia ITK?
Did you forget all those 'pushed' onto sickness type benefits during your glorious fuhrer's reign?
Nothing like 'out of site,out of mind' to massage the unemployment figures.

And talking of education,my sister at a senior school in an inner city tells me British kids really struggle to advance,as a lot of the teacher's time is spent trying to help the foreign kids keep up.

Oh and Morrisons is useless,worst service of any of the supermarkets,I live next door to one,my friend works in one in Kendal,I used to live near the head office...if they can't get their own business to work well,then blame the staff they really are a bunch of idiots.
The same local people make ASDA et al a pleasure to shop in,Morrisons cut corners,have higher prices,then like to pass the buck....oh and just been into the Gibraltar branch,so many of the goods mislabeled it was a joke trying to work out prices!..
...Go on Hedda,your turn

The checkout girls are nice to look at even they are bit dippy. Management in Margate Morrisons look about 10, the queue busting is a joke, early morning forget it only self service is open, they always crash and get the automated voice over and over, talk about cost cutting. Management never in the wrong according to them just floor staff. I remember in Asda the managers switched everyone to different apartments the result was a failure, just what we tried to tell them it would do. The prices are getting ridiculous expensive in Morrisons on their own brand shit.

Pattaya wrote:
How's the amnesia ITK?
Did you forget all those 'pushed' onto sickness type benefits during your glorious fuhrer's reign?

Strangely enough - I don't remember that !
I remember people saying that happened - but they were the self-same people who had every excuse under the sun NOT to find work, Funny that, isn't it?

Did this "pushing people" actually prevent them from getting jobs then ?

andrew wrote:
Pattaya wrote:
In The Know wrote:
honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
It might well be engineered, but some people don't half embrace it!

How can we "engineer" huge swathes of people that are unemployable?

Did we force them not to read and write?
Do we prevent them from applying for jobs?
Do we reject ideal candidates, just "to punish them"?

Read the comments of the Morrisons boss - then you'll see why most firms wont have them at any price. (These firms are businesses - not social services).

The cream will always rise to the top.
People will pay (well) for skills in demand

How's the amnesia ITK?
Did you forget all those 'pushed' onto sickness type benefits during your glorious fuhrer's reign?
Nothing like 'out of site,out of mind' to massage the unemployment figures.

And talking of education,my sister at a senior school in an inner city tells me British kids really struggle to advance,as a lot of the teacher's time is spent trying to help the foreign kids keep up.

Oh and Morrisons is useless,worst service of any of the supermarkets,I live next door to one,my friend works in one in Kendal,I used to live near the head office...if they can't get their own business to work well,then blame the staff they really are a bunch of idiots.
The same local people make ASDA et al a pleasure to shop in,Morrisons cut corners,have higher prices,then like to pass the buck....oh and just been into the Gibraltar branch,so many of the goods mislabeled it was a joke trying to work out prices!..
...Go on Hedda,your turn

The checkout girls are nice to look at even they are bit dippy. Management in Margate Morrisons look about 10, the queue busting is a joke, early morning forget it only self service is open, they always crash and get the automated voice over and over, talk about cost cutting. Management never in the wrong according to them just floor staff. I remember in Asda the managers switched everyone to different apartments the result was a failure, just what we tried to tell them it would do. The prices are getting ridiculous expensive in Morrisons on their own brand shit.

Morrisons employ foreign monkeys behind the scenes,then not enough staff in front of.Same in most of their stores.
Those auto check out machines are really badly designed,the staff in the other supermarkets open the bags ready for you to pack,they just did it for me in Tescos.In morrisons you lift the bag to open it,and then have to wait for the staff to tell the machine all is ok.
Perhaps we should all be rich enough to shop in Harrods?

Sounds like a plan. In Harrods you still get the cliché maybe 'Then they still say please remove the last item.'
Surely it cost more to run the self service checkout, in the mornings there is only one and she leaves about 10, then everyone is queuing up for the self service. Only one old boiler who manages it all runs back and fourth scan bit of paper at the till if there is a issue with them. Sadly my dog only eats Morrisons own brand dog food.

Tesco self service is more reliable but it likes to short change you.

Have you ever seen the posh cars getting parked out the Job Centre Pattaya ? They belong to the foreigners go in the JC swinging the car key about.

ITK should be concerned.

andrew wrote:
ITK should be concerned.

I'm very concerned - about when you find the time to do your "job searching" LOL !

In The Know wrote:
Pattaya wrote:
How's the amnesia ITK?
Did you forget all those 'pushed' onto sickness type benefits during your glorious fuhrer's reign?

Strangely enough - I don't remember that !
I remember people saying that happened - but they were the self-same people who had every excuse under the sun NOT to find work, Funny that, isn't it?

Did this "pushing people" actually prevent them from getting jobs then ?

Too busy slagging off people to actually check out the facts?

www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/apr/02...-disability-benefits

I take the appropriate steps ITK even got the work programme tomorrow.