www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30672179

John Lewis report sales in shops "flat" (ie no increase or decrease) but online sales UP 19%

Puts a lie to the claims sometimes heard that online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway.

it only takes a couple of bad experiences with on-line shopping to return to in-store shopping where you still have buyer protections. (and it's far more fun)

#On-line shopping should be subject to VAT

#the vast majority of goods bought on-line are now China made thus the inward spiral increases which is the OPPOSITE to a market economy.

#the internet has been a terrific boon to all but it has increased (a) JK's Green Ink Brigade ability to actually have an effect and (b) a handful of corporations to dominate and become more monopolistic

ie prime example : JK's beloved Amazon makes it easy to get wonderful titles that were once difficult to obtain plus e-books which I love but..Amazon make virtually no profit whilst simultaneously putting out of business 100s of small Ye Olde Book Shoppes and 1000s of employees.

## these are the problems facing politicians who seem oblivious and more concerned with reacting to JK's (tiny) Green ink Brigade of fanatics.

In The Know (as always) wrote:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30672179

John Lewis report sales in shops "flat" (ie no increase or decrease) but online sales UP 19%

Puts a lie to the claims sometimes heard that online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway.

You have to account for the fact that John Lewis is turning into a display warehouse for its stock.
They keep goods on the shelves, as if they are on sale, like an actual real shop, and when you go to buy them you are told (mumbled at) that they don't stock them (ever) and that you have to order them online.
So it is likely that some went to the shop first and then ordered it from home, or from Selfridges for spite!

In The Know (as always) wrote:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30672179

John Lewis report sales in shops "flat" (ie no increase or decrease) but online sales UP 19%

Puts a lie to the claims sometimes heard that online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway.

Online buyers are different people,and not a single group.
People who buy from say M&S,John Lewis etc are likely to also go into those shops as well...but maybe sometimes find it easier/cheaper to do it online..

...now ebay/Amazon etc in my opinion tend to be the kind of peeps that do most of their shopping online..

...just my thoughts on the matter...and a well pointed out post.

In The Know (as always) wrote:
online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway


My head hurts....

honey!oh sugar sugar. wrote:
In The Know (as always) wrote:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-30672179

John Lewis report sales in shops "flat" (ie no increase or decrease) but online sales UP 19%

Puts a lie to the claims sometimes heard that online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway.

You have to account for the fact that John Lewis is turning into a display warehouse for its stock.
They keep goods on the shelves, as if they are on sale, like an actual real shop, and when you go to buy them you are told (mumbled at) that they don't stock them (ever) and that you have to order them online.
So it is likely that some went to the shop first and then ordered it from home, or from Selfridges for spite!

Dear me Honey should of put him in a Boston Crab and make him say 'Uncle'

SP17 wrote:
In The Know (as always) wrote:
online buyers were people who would have gone to a shop anyway


My head hurts....




ITK is complicating things here.

The problem is its not a level playing field between on-line and high street.
For example, if I want to buy a new sofa from, say, John Lewis, If I go into the store and buy it, and then get it delivered, if I don't like it, too bad. BUT if I order the sofa on-line and get it delivered, then if I don't like it, I can demand John Lewis take it back. The "Distance Selling Act" makes on-line far preferable for large items like furniture that is traditionally delivered than buying in person at a store. (You can still view it in-store. Just go home to order it!).

comrade hedda wrote:
..Amazon make virtually no profit whilst simultaneously putting out of business 100s of small Ye Olde Book Shoppes and 1000s of employees.


Its NOT Amazon doing that - its the customers doh !

Just as the Pound Shop trash are driving other shops out of business.

When they are left with no alternative they will blame someone else !

In The Know (as always) wrote:
comrade hedda wrote:
..Amazon make virtually no profit whilst simultaneously putting out of business 100s of small Ye Olde Book Shoppes and 1000s of employees.


Its NOT Amazon doing that - its the customers doh !

Just as the Pound Shop trash are driving other shops out of business.

When they are left with no alternative they will blame someone else !

I don't agree. Amazon, by undercutting other retailers, because they can afford to make a loss in certain territories/on certain products are playing a significant part in putting other retailers out of business. It's stupidly simplistic to say its the customers.

dixie wrote:
It's stupidly simplistic to say its the customers.

Nothing new there then.


When buying a book from Amazon (who are fantastic), look at the 'used' copy section - where the book's condition is described. Often, 'as new' - but at a vastly reduced price.

You often end up really just paying for delivery, the next day!

SP17 wrote:
dixie wrote:
It's stupidly simplistic to say its the customers.

Nothing new there then.


When buying a book from Amazon (who are fantastic), look at the 'used' copy section - where the book's condition is described. Often, 'as new' - but at a vastly reduced price.

You often end up really just paying for delivery, the next day!




I can't fault the third party buying on Amazon.

Online shopping has its negatives and positives but for me Amazon is brilliant for books, CDs and DVDs - great range, efficient delivery. Like music retail, the shops never adapted and deserved to sink without trace.

dixie wrote:

I don't agree. Amazon, by undercutting other retailers, because they can afford to make a loss in certain territories/on certain products are playing a significant part in putting other retailers out of business. It's stupidly simplistic to say its the customers.

Not true.

Amazon invested heavily and gambled that it would eventually pay-oo (as did Sky TV).

"Other" retailers! are going out of business because -

(a) they cannot compete with the economies of scale or range that online offers (all items available everywhere !)
(b) the stupid public will always go where its cheapest - hence Pound shops - then look aghast when they have no alternative choice, and
(c) location, location, location. All high street retailers will only get the passing trade - Online is everywhere.

JK2006 wrote:
Online shopping has its negatives and positives but for me Amazon is brilliant for books, CDs and DVDs - great range, efficient delivery.

The "key" is the fact that they don't have to carry much stock.

Say you have 400 High Street shops - you would need at least one item in each of them.

If it is a rare and slow moving item you will simply not stock it - it will not pay for its shelf spare.

Online, on the other hand only needs small stocks as they can be "sold" everywhere.

Absolutely; which is why they are so great and so much normal retail is so bad. That's the way the world has gone. Inevitable.

In The Know (as always) wrote:

Just as the Pound Shop trash are driving other shops out of business

The Poundshop/Poundland shops sell the exact same products as Waitrose or Saintsbury's.

Sanitary items (Detol/Andrex), toiletries/toothpaste, batteries, chocolate etc. - are all the same branded names.

Poundland is a UK registered PLC - and quoted on the LSE.



Old perceptions take some shifting...

In The Know (as always) wrote:
JK2006 wrote:
Online shopping has its negatives and positives but for me Amazon is brilliant for books, CDs and DVDs - great range, efficient delivery.

The "key" is the fact that they don't have to carry much stock.

Say you have 400 High Street shops - you would need at least one item in each of them.

If it is a rare and slow moving item you will simply not stock it - it will not pay for its shelf spare.

Online, on the other hand only needs small stocks as they can be "sold" everywhere.


You haven't heard of shops like Argos then?

On the High Street and on line.

All items available in shop - to buy, or collect. Or buy on line - with delivery or collection...

JK2006 wrote:
Absolutely; which is why they are so great and so much normal retail is so bad. That's the way the world has gone. Inevitable.

The similarity with the record industry is staggering.

Woolies started it all off !
They didn't want slow selling new releases so only stocked the Top 30 (forgetting of course, to explain how something got into the Top 30 if no one could buy it !)
The result?
The biggest singles seller in the UK went out of business.

Supermarkets followed suit .... again ONLY stocking TV advertised / major sellers.
Of course if you wanted a new release you had to go to a real record shop ! (but as they were only selling a few copies a week the record shop didn't make much money)
Then ... when that release was selling BIG you popped to Tesco to buy it - because it was £2 cheaper than the record shop - so the record shops didn't make any money there either !!!

Result?
Record shops are extinct .... and record labels only market re-issued / major artist / TV advertised product.

In The Know (as always) wrote:
JK2006 wrote:
Absolutely; which is why they are so great and so much normal retail is so bad. That's the way the world has gone. Inevitable.

The similarity with the record industry is staggering.

Woolies started it all off !
They didn't want slow selling new releases so only stocked the Top 30 (forgetting of course, to explain how something got into the Top 30 if no one could buy it !)
The result?
The biggest singles seller in the UK went out of business.

Supermarkets followed suit .... again ONLY stocking TV advertised / major sellers.
Of course if you wanted a new release you had to go to a real record shop ! (but as they were only selling a few copies a week the record shop didn't make much money)
Then ... when that release was selling BIG you popped to Tesco to buy it - because it was £2 cheaper than the record shop - so the record shops didn't make any money there either !!!

Result?
Record shops are extinct .... and record labels only market re-issued / major artist / TV advertised product.

ITK you are spot on Zavvi went bust due to their contract with Woolies, I worked for Woolies a year before it went bust.