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I live in a country which will give me a vote over whether to leave the EU, but not whether we become involved in something that has the potential (albeit in reality probably low) of escalating into WW3...
Wyot wrote: I live in a country which will give me a vote over whether to leave the EU, but not whether we become involved in something that has the potential (albeit in reality probably low) of escalating into WW3...
In the 1930's, there was wide support for an amendment to the US Constitution - to give citizens the right to a refendum on going to war.
A poll had 75% in favour of the Ludlow Amendment. However people soon became preoccupied with WWII, the economic downturn etc; and support wained.
Opponents likened the proposal to having a town meeting on whether to send a fire engine to a burning house. Elected governments now make the calls.
Oscar Freedom wrote: Wyot wrote: I live in a country which will give me a vote over whether to leave the EU, but not whether we become involved in something that has the potential (albeit in reality probably low) of escalating into WW3...
In the 1930's, there was wide support for an amendment to the US Constitution - to give citizens the right to a refendum on going to war.
A poll had 75% in favour of the Ludlow Amendment. However people soon became preoccupied with WWII, the economic downturn etc; and support wained.
Opponents likened the proposal to having a town meeting on whether to send a fire engine to a burning house. Elected governments now make the calls.
I never wanted a vote on the EU either Barney.
Elected governments don't make the calls - the media does. This is why you (and so many others) got so confused about lockdowns; and why the conspiracy theorists can thrive...
An excellent piece about the media and democracy in the UK. Giving the facts and percentages of media coverage, and types thereof.
Where, in the conclusions, optimists like me are said to think that we have a huge variety of information from numerous sources in the UK.
In the same conclusions, the description of pessimist - in the media/government debate - would clearly seem to include chaps like you.
I'm so pleased for you Barney that you think you have found something that validates you as a "good optimist" and me as a "bad pessimist". I mean, it does no such thing as, of course, you have misunderstood it; but plus ca change...plus ca change x
Ofcom has a biased to some extent however it's part of the government. The heads of Ofcom are an elitist they went to Davos. GB News and Talk TV are the paid opposition but are targets for Ofcom.
Neil Oliver days are probably numbered also. GB News wanted Mark Steyn to pay the fines despite pulling up facts, stats and figures from government websites and big pharma.
Talk TV is owned by the establishment it's Murdoch owned! Sky News UK is owned by a liberal parent company called Comcast.
Exactly stupid Barney; who clearly thinks public opinion has NO influence on Governments whatsoever. Without public opinion and media hype millions who died from the over reaction to Covid would still be alive.
Oscar Freedom wrote: Wyot wrote: Elected governments don't make the calls - the media does
Well, this London School of Economics article doesn't concur with that assertion.
Your article is not about - and makes no comment - on how our Government makes decisions. It is about the plurality of media ownership in our democracy.
If you can't immediately grasp the distinction, and the passage of time does not assist with this either, then kind counsel is to avoid debate with me going forward...
Wyot wrote: Oscar Freedom wrote: Wyot wrote: Elected governments don't make the calls - the media does
Well, this London School of Economics article doesn't concur with that assertion.
Your article is not about - and makes no comment - on how our Government makes decisions. It is about the plurality of media ownership in our democracy.
If you can't immediately grasp the distinction, and the passage of time does not assist with this either, then kind counsel is to avoid debate with me going forward...
Green Man wrote:
[quote]Wyot wrote:
[quote]Oscar Freedom wrote:
[quote]Wyot wrote:
Wyot went to uni and went to posh school.
Well uni yes but prior to that a state comprehensive GM.
However when at uni I found it usually routine to equal or out perform those from Eton, Harrow, King's or Winchester (I studied law so met a lot of them). Primarily, I think, because of all the books I obsessively read outside of reading lists and for no reason other than love.
I have my dear old Dad to thank for that with his many great books always within reach (Dostoevsky when off ill from school aged 13 set my mind alight, Dickens, Hardy, Tolstoy, Russell, Swift, Dante...and on...).
No education beats a self motivated one. And the home environment, not money, is the main factor.
That said, I didn't - and don't - have the connections of the "posh school" kids and never completely fitted in (not that I tried; while at times I would have liked to, people from privilege can smell when you aren't, and there seemed - and still seems - little point pretending...).
Money does buy social place and connections, and in that sense puts mere education and natural intelligence firmly in its place.
Well uni yes but prior to that a state comprehensive GM.
However when at uni I found it usually routine to equal or out perform those from Eton, Harrow, King's or Winchester (I studied law so met a lot of them). Primarily, I think, because of all the books I obsessively read outside of reading lists and for no reason other than love.
I have my dear old Dad to thank for that with his many great books always within reach (Dostoevsky when off ill from school aged 13 set my mind alight, Dickens, Hardy, Tolstoy, Russell, Swift, Dante...and on...).
No education beats a self motivated one. And the home environment, not money, is the main factor.
That said, I didn't - and don't - have the connections of the "posh school" kids and never completely fitted in (not that I tried; while at times I would have liked to, people from privilege can smell when you aren't, and there seemed - and still seems - little point pretending...).
Money does buy social place and connections, and in that sense puts mere education and natural intelligence firmly in its place.
Well uni yes but prior to that a state comprehensive GM.
However when at uni I found it usually routine to equal or out perform those from Eton, Harrow, King's or Winchester (I studied law so met a lot of them). Primarily, I think, because of all the books I obsessively read outside of reading lists and for no reason other than love.
I have my dear old Dad to thank for that with his many great books always within reach (Dostoevsky when off ill from school aged 13 set my mind alight, Dickens, Hardy, Tolstoy, Russell, Swift, Dante...and on...).
No education beats a self motivated one. And the home environment, not money, is the main factor.
That said, I didn't - and don't - have the connections of the "posh school" kids and never completely fitted in (not that I tried; while at times I would have liked to, people from privilege can smell when you aren't, and there seemed - and still seems - little point pretending...).
Money does buy social place and connections, and in that sense puts mere education and natural intelligence firmly in its place.
Wyot: "Wouldn't it an absolutely spiffing idea chaps wot, wot,wot; if we pulled our socks up and show the Winchester boys and girls how we study wot, wot, wot?".
You and your class-mate must been like the remove in Billy Bunter books.
Wyot wrote: Money does buy social place and connections
Perhaps it did in the past, but - in successful businesses/organisations these days - nobody cares which uniniversity you went to. Or even knows.
Daddy is is irrelevant as the boss Mr Khan (2/Delhi) only needs to know who can solve problems and/or provide ideas for profit enhancement. Not caring about the source of your expertise.
Rewards are good - but replacements are plentiful - ensuring our punctual arrival daily at our office places. At Canary Wharf Tower - there's a random breathalyser check.
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