Fascinating how this drama will not die down.

Will the Teflon Don successfully divert his base from the matter or is this a frist dramatic chink in the Trump armour?

The Tea Party and then MAGA have invested so much energy in the so-called "Deep State" and the notion a cabal of evil (Deomocrat ?) pedopfiles run the USA including the claim Hilary Clinton ran a pedo ring from a Washington Pizza Restaurant that had secret tunnels to the White House.

It's never died down and Jeffrey Epstein became a core party of these claims.

The very clever Democrat strategist James Carvile who was behind the Bill Clinton and Barack Obama wins thinks Trump is in real trouble with his base.

The brilliant journalist Tina Brown, former editor of my favbourite magazines Vanity Fair & The New Yorker and founder of The Daily Beast believes Epstein was murdered. She says Epstein threatened her.

Why do the MAGA lot so desperately want to see this list anyway? They are obsessed by "pedos". If it is not "reds" or further back witches - I suppose something will always fill this need in a lot of people.

Really, they need to take up a hobby...

Interesting that Tina Brown is saying that.

There was a piece on the news recently about how leading male online influencers, like Joe Rogan, are now criticising Trump.

I found this analysis interesting (title: "Trump Attempts to Kill a Conspiracy Theory That Boosted Him"). He says that the conspiracy theorists won't be satisfied, no matter how much information is released.

Of course the entire Epstein affair is being used for political gain against Trump.

Usually sane people are screeching why is Ghislaine Maxwell in jail if there is no list?

Yet as Spiked correctly points out, anyone can go to the Dept of Justice website where the Maxwell case is documented and read that she was convicted for apparently trafficking under age teens to Epstein alone. No-one else is named yet MAGA and Trump detractors promote the claim there is some incredible list of 100s of people.

Some are even claiming the list includes most of Congress and the Senate (Repubs and Dems)

I think Trump asking for Grand Jury transcripts to be released will just make it worse for him with claims of a cover-up.

That's just mad. It's disturbing that so many people seem to really want to believe that children and/or young people are being abused by the rich and famous. I agree with Wyot. Remember all that "VIP paedophile" rubbish that exploded around the time of the Jimmy Savile allegations.

Regarding Epstein, I doubt that his friends and acquaintances were any more likely to be involved in his sexual activities than ordinary people are involved in the sexual activities of their friends and acquaintances. But this seems to be a conspiracy theory that people are clinging to (salivating over?) and I agree that releasing the transcripts probably won't satisfy them (they'd probably still have questioned that prison CCTV, even if a minute hadn't been missing, and claimed it was faked, or something).

The ghost of Virginia Giuffre also seems potent, with The Times clearly preferring to believe her "diary" (which was apparently written only this year) and her claims that Epstein filmed guests and used it as blackmail than any denials from the FBI. (Judging from a Times Radio discussion on YouTube that I posted in the Giuffre thread.)

Forgot to mention, about that "VIP paedo" madness here, remember that "Elm Guest House list" concocted by convicted boiler room scammer Chris Fay? So many people online seemed to "know" that the famous people on the list (including one person to whom Fay had given a nickname, which also did the rounds online as if it was fact) had visited the guest house and abused children. Bill Maloney (Baloney? whatever happened to him?) did at least one interview with Chris Fay (possibly from a jail, at least the setting looked institutional), posted on YouTube, where they indulged their fantasies of child abuse. A right grotty pair.

So I wonder if "lists" are part of paedo conspiracy theories.

Dear Donald

If a list exists and is published millions will believe one or more of:

- it is fake
- it is partial
- it has been made up

You are better off dropping the whole thing, as it will just make the situation worse. Take the flak. Threaten to bomb somewhere or "grab a pussy".

Your fanbase will swiftly rally after that.

Best wishes

Wyot

Jeffrey Epstein's brother says Trump and he were close friends, so much so that he'd witnessed Jeffrey Epstein asking Trump why he slept with so many married women. Jeffrey Epstein had apparently forewarned his brother about the charges he was facing, saying he'd been stupid.



Epstein accuser Maria Farmer (I think she might have been his first accuser, the older sister of Annie Farmer, who played a role in Ghislaine Maxwell's downfall) has a story about seeing Trump at Epstein's office one evening and Epstein supposedly implying he had a girl for him (but not her).

Jo wrote:
Forgot to mention, about that "VIP paedo" madness here, remember that "Elm Guest House list" concocted by convicted boiler room scammer Chris Fay? So many people online seemed to "know" that the famous people on the list (including one person to whom Fay had given a nickname, which also did the rounds online as if it was fact) had visited the guest house and abused children. Bill Maloney (Baloney? whatever happened to him?) did at least one interview with Chris Fay (possibly from a jail, at least the setting looked institutional), posted on YouTube, where they indulged their fantasies of child abuse. A right grotty pair.
So I wonder if "lists" are part of paedo conspiracy theories.


I uncovered that that aggressive nutter Bill Baloney was falsely claiming he had won a prestigious award at the New York Film Festival.

What had really happened was he "won" a prize at an amateur "NY film & video festival" whereby amateur film-makers paid a large fee to enter their film and everyone won a prize.

There are dozens of these phony festivals each year in the US.

The prestigious NY Film Festival" wrote to Baloney and told him to stop inferring he had won a prize in their festival when they had never heard of him.

I think that malicious old Chris Fay kicked the bucket.

That's interesting. What brass neck Maloney had to claim to have won that prize. Fay didn't look healthy in Maloney's interviews, so I'm not surprised he's no longer around.