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Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS
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TOPIC: Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS
#64832
BR

Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
The PEOPLE want the BANKERS TAXED not the poor CUT.

Today the STUDENTS of the UK have fired the first shot.

Hats off to them.

The PEOPLE of the UK are READY to take to the Streets./

We have been ignored by NEW LABOUR

We have been ignored by the LIBERALS

We are about to be ignored by CAMERON's NEW TORIES

Enough is enough.

We need FAIR CUTS on the POLICE and COURTS

STOP THE WAR IN AFGANISTAN and then NO CUTS would be neceessary - it is that simple.
 
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#64838
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
You think rioting is fantastic? Bizarre as always.
 
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#64839
Rosey Thorn

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
"Anarchism is a political philosophy which considers the state undesirable, unnecessary, and harmful, and instead promotes a stateless society, or anarchy. It seeks to diminish or even abolish authority in the conduct of human relations"

I think this describes BR, especially the desire to abolish authority (the police). The promotion and support of rioting is only to be expected.

BR is such an easy target I question why I bother reacting but maybe if enough people do then perhaps she/he and their stupid posts will go away
 
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#64840
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
You really have to make a conscious effort to use so many random capitalizations. Bizarre.
 
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#64841
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
Well I have mixed feelings. I'm pleased that young people have at last woken up to the fact that they should express an opinion. Since the 60s, when we protested day and night (It's Good News Week) young people seem mired in apathy. I'm sad, though, that it's only selfishness that has provoked reaction. Me Me Me. No "stop being beastly towards victims of false allegations" banners in Trafalgar Square. Just "don't take away MY money".
 
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#64842
BR

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
So protesting against unfairness is wrong >

What about SOLIDARITY in Poland ?

What about the people who stood on the Berlin Wall ?

What about those who protested against the Tsars in 1917 ?

What about the French in 1789 who helped to create democracy ?

What about the suffrajets in the early part of the 20th century ?

What about Nelson Mandela in South AFrica ?


Many of you seem to forget change from evil often is accompanied by personal sacrifice.

Jesus himself died after turning over the tables in the Temple.

So if you say I am anti State - then you are right. The "state" is by definition evil and supports the rich against the "slave class" History shows us this.

In 21st Century surely it is time to dismantle the state and get rid of the Police ( who only antagonise the public - try ringing them for help and you wont get any ) and the other apparatus which you have been brainwashed into believing actually is necessary.

What is necessary is EDUCATION and DOCTORS and CARE for the ill - weak and vulnerable. Those who fight wars ( states ) are evil - they in my view represent the Devil's hold on our world. Without "states" we would have no war - and therefore people could work to eradicate poverty and disease. That is what we should be working towards surely ? That is a positive vision of the future - rather than one filled with tanks and nuclear warheads and violent clashes on the streets because the Government has spent all the money on the rich banksters so now has to raid the piggy banks of the children in society.
 
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#64844
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
BR wrote:
So protesting against unfairness is wrong >

What about SOLIDARITY in Poland ?


They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital

BR wrote:
What about the people who stood on the Berlin Wall ?

They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital

BR wrote:
What about those who protested against the Tsars in 1917 ?

They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital


BR wrote:
What about the French in 1789 who helped to create democracy ?

They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital. Mind you, they did kill a lot of people while those you call "chavs" looked on in fascinated glee.

BR wrote:
What about the suffrajets {sic}in the early part of the 20th century ?

They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital

BR wrote:
What about Nelson Mandela in South AFrica ?

You're not serious?


BR wrote:
Many of you seem to forget change from evil often is accompanied by personal sacrifice.

But not by smashing windows and hospitalising ten people....

BR wrote:
Jesus himself died after turning over the tables in the Temple.

I don't recall him smashing the windows, though. Or hospitalising anyone.



BR wrote:
So if you say I am anti State - then you are right. The "state" is by definition evil and supports the rich against the "slave class" History shows us this.

It shows us nothing of the sort. Unless, of course, you're a simpleton with a very narrow view.

BR wrote:
In 21st Century surely it is time to dismantle the state and get rid of the Police ( who only antagonise the public - try ringing them for help and you wont get any ) and the other apparatus which you have been brainwashed into believing actually is necessary.

Ah, the brainwashing thing. I wondered when that would come up. Getting rid of the police would, I'm sure, be very convenient for you personally. Although I doubt very much whether you'd be quite so keen when the law of the jungle replaced the law of the land.

BR wrote:
What is necessary is EDUCATION and DOCTORS and CARE for the ill - weak and vulnerable. Those who fight wars ( states ) are evil - they in my view represent the Devil's hold on our world. Without "states" we would have no war - and therefore people could work to eradicate poverty and disease. That is what we should be working towards surely ? That is a positive vision of the future - rather than one filled with tanks and nuclear warheads and violent clashes on the streets because the Government has spent all the money on the rich banksters so now has to raid the piggy banks of the children in society.

So who's going to ensure the freedoms of the citizens of this little Utopia of yours? You've abolished the state which would fund the institutions necessary to provide the healthcare and education. And you've abolished the police who offer the only line of defence against those who would otherwise rob, kill, and rape them. This latest posting of yours demonstrates an escalation in your condition. I've begged you before to get help. I'd only urge you once again to do so.
 
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#64847
BR

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
I dont disagree with you LO. I can see the logic in your statements. However, it is a fact that most revolutions are not bloodless.

I am a Christian and I look to the Bible for inspiration. Nationalism and States are a modern invention. Prior to this people basically were territorial but did not organise themselves in a Nation State which did not start until the last 200 years.

Therefore, I truly believe that we dont need "enforcers" like the Police and Army - because peer pressure and values are surely enough to organise society.

Drugs and arms running are new things as well. They have grown up because of the nation state - and the police spend most of their time dealing with organised crime.

Laws are passed not to ensure safety - but to ensure money for the Justice System. Under Sharia Law and other older types of law things were more simple - modern law is basically built on technicalities which means ordinary people have no idea what is going on ( Ask Innocent Accused who kept posting on here about how crazy things were in his trial and ask JK who found everything moving like jelly in his trial(s) because he could disprove the orginal charges )

We live in a very corrupt world - in 200 years time people will look back and ask why we put up with such awful corruption and such brainwashing and such things.

I truly believe that eventually the "people" will come through and society will become decent and fair. At the moment we are in the thrall of big business and we are pumped every day with adverts and media campaigns via news to "conform" and to be basically "slaves" to this system.

We killed hundreds of thousands in Iraq - but none of us feel any guilt ( do you >? ) yet your tax and my tax paid to kill those people. Yes - you and I paid to kill innocent people in Iraq. We agreed to killing children and women and men who had done us no wrong. Is that right ? We pretend to ourselves that "we" are not involved because BLAIR and the ARMY did the deed - but we paid for it and we voted for Blair and it is blood on our hands. We cant escape that - we did it.

We pretend that we have no blame - that our Government has nothing to do with us - but by sitting idly by and letting it do these things we are not better than the Nazis.

I recognise how BAD we all are - I recognise how my words of peace mean nothing when our UK Army is killing people in my name in Afganistan this very day. That is wrong, God says to me that it is wrong, It is wrong to kill - it is wrong for me to let my Government kill in my name.

That is why I am anti State. The State commits crime - in my name and is supported by a criminal police force and an army that they force to kill in my name.

I have strong Christian beliefs and it makes me physically sick to see the pain and suffering my country does in my name and the way in which we harass the weak and the poor. That is not what Jesus said that should happen. We should be taking care of the weak and loving our enemies. That is Christianity. Not bombing and killing and making people pay for education whilst bailing out the stinking rich.

That is why I support the kids out there who want a future. Their innocent idealism is something to love - something to believe in - maybe they can create a better world. We should be investing in them - believing in them - not putting them into debt slavery for 10s of years.

By tying them to debt at 18 years old we are going to create generations of people who see work as slavery to the state. That is not the way to educate. The way to educate is by showing these people that money is not important - it is a means - not an end. That living life generously and living to love is the way to live.

Revolution may include some pain - that is what I attempted to show. People have been killed and imprisoned for trying to make the world a better place. Today the students tried to do that - I salute them and back them and believe in them. We should all do that because they are our future. Kids are generally good and then get corrupted by life and society and the state. Let's try and give them a good future.
 
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#64849
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
One minute you're supporting the coalition heart and soul,the next supporting students rioting against the very cuts they introduced.

The major revolutions in history often achieved quite tragic results.
The Russian revolution of 1917 ushered in a government that managed to murder even more people than Hitler!
The French revolution of 1789 soon turned into Robespierre's Guillotine and Nappy's single handed(well armed lol) devastation of the whole continent of europe.
Solidarity and the Berlin wall were far more peaceful,and were not involved in violence.

Be very careful what you wish for,often the desired result is far different to what you hoped for.
 
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#64850
owen

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
BR wrote:


Today the STUDENTS of the UK have fired the first shot


Talaban means student
 
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#64851
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
BR: was Jesus's antics reported in the (famously DISCREDITED) Daily Mail, or did you just assume these facts? I mean FACTS. I MEAN facts. I mEaN FacTs. I...
 
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#64852
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
BR wrote:
I dont disagree with you LO. I can see the logic in your statements. However, it is a fact that most revolutions are not bloodless.

You might not disagree with me, but I certainly disagree with you. Profoundly. And may I remind you that here we are not talking about revolutions. Your thread concerns today's riot, and your use of the word "fantastic" to describe what the organisers have condemned with utter disgust.

BR wrote:
I am a Christian and I look to the Bible for inspiration.

Where in the Bible is the advice {or "inspiration"} offered to smash windows and hospitalise people?


BR wrote:
Nationalism and States are a modern invention. Prior to this people basically were territorial but did not organise themselves in a Nation State which did not start until the last 200 years.

A fascinating take on history. I'm sure that Octavian Caesar would have loved your insight into what Pax Romana was conceived and executed in order to achieve.


BR wrote:
[quote]Therefore, I truly believe that we dont need "enforcers" like the Police and Army - because peer pressure and values are surely enough to organise society.[quote]


True, true, all those independent minded people pre 1810 didn't feel the need for armies or judges or magistrates or thief-takers, did they? You lived in someone else's land and they owned you lock, stock and barrell. That's why there were no uprisings, insurgencies, rebellions, civil unrests or wars back then. Where do you get this stuff from?


BR wrote:
Drugs and arms running are new things as well. They have grown up because of the nation state - and the police spend most of their time dealing with organised crime.


Are you seriously suggesting that there was no trade in armaments and other weapons of war before 1810? If there was a shortage of strategic and tactical strike weapons that's hardly surprising. But what they lacked in hardware they made up for very enthusiastically in manpower, and mercenaries were well paid and extremely common.
Chemical narcotics are obviously a modern invention, but a trade in the more "natural" variety is, perhaps, the second oldest in the world and you're an idiot if you believe that the widespread use and availability of these drugs wasn't a fact of historical life.
It's also interesting that in your attempts to paint this rosy view of the world before "the last 200 years" you fail to remember that these nations-but-not-states indulged in genocide of a horrendous nature {your own dear churches inquisitions, witch hunts {why were they any better than today's - which you yourself are always shrieking about but, at least, don't result in hangings or burnings?}, and the enforced acquisition of land. How about the Conquistadors and the horrific fate of the Incas? And while we're at it, honourable mention must also be made of those who traded in human beings as if they were no more than a couple of hundred pounds of tea? You thinks drug smuggling is in some way worse than slavery? What a strange, twisted and - above all - utterly confused person you are.



BR wrote:
Laws are passed not to ensure safety - but to ensure money for the Justice System. Under Sharia Law and other older types of law things were more simple - modern law is basically built on technicalities which means ordinary people have no idea what is going on ( Ask Innocent Accused who kept posting on here about how crazy things were in his trial and ask JK who found everything moving like jelly in his trial(s) because he could disprove the orginal charges )

Now you're going off on one again. There's much more to the conception, draughting and enactment of Law than you are suggesting here.
The view you present here is simplistic and funamentally ill conceived.


BR wrote:
We live in a very corrupt world

Had you left it there you'd have done yourself a favour, for there's certainly no arguing with that. However, you spoil what began well by continuing;


BR wrote:
- in 200 years time people will look back and ask why we put up with such awful corruption and such brainwashing and such things.

Which, of course, is your usual and hackneyed "brainwashing" routine. The wording, by the way, makes it look like you are becoming more than a little hysterical at this point.

BR wrote:
I truly believe that eventually the "people" will come through and society will become decent and fair.


You do? When has this ever been true of mankind? Why would human nature change that much?


BR wrote:
At the moment we are in the thrall of big business and we are pumped every day with adverts and media campaigns via news to "conform" and to be basically "slaves" to this system.

*Gasp*. I agree with {almost} every word of that. Except I'd substitute the word "conform" for "consume". Otherwise, just this once, you're right on the money.

BR wrote:
We killed hundreds of thousands in Iraq

I know.

BR wrote:
- but none of us feel any guilt

We Don't?

BR wrote:
( do you >? )

Actually, I do. That you admit that you don't is something that perhaps as a Christian you should be thinking about. From where in your precious Bible do you draw the inspiration for such a breathtaking lack of compassion? It's possible, of course, that you don't actually mean this, and we'll have a look at that in a minute.

BR wrote:
yet your tax and my tax paid to kill those people. Yes - you and I paid to kill innocent people in Iraq. We agreed to killing children and women and men who had done us no wrong. Is that right ? We pretend to ourselves that "we" are not involved because BLAIR and the ARMY did the deed - but we paid for it and we voted for Blair and it is blood on our hands. We cant escape that - we did it.
We pretend that we have no blame - that our Government has nothing to do with us - but by sitting idly by and letting it do these things we are not better than the Nazis.

I recognise how BAD we all are - I recognise how my words of peace mean nothing when our UK Army is killing people in my name in Afganistan this very day. That is wrong, God says to me that it is wrong, It is wrong to kill - it is wrong for me to let my Government kill in my name.

That is why I am anti State. The State commits crime - in my name and is supported by a criminal police force and an army that they force to kill in my name.

I have strong Christian beliefs and it makes me physically sick to see the pain and suffering my country does in my name and the way in which we harass the weak and the poor. That is not what Jesus said that should happen. We should be taking care of the weak and loving our enemies. That is Christianity. Not bombing and killing and making people pay for education whilst bailing out the stinking rich.

That is why I support the kids out there who want a future. Their innocent idealism is something to love - something to believe in - maybe they can create a better world. We should be investing in them - believing in them - not putting them into debt slavery for 10s of years.

By tying them to debt at 18 years old we are going to create generations of people who see work as slavery to the state. That is not the way to educate. The way to educate is by showing these people that money is not important - it is a means - not an end. That living life generously and living to love is the way to live.


That was quite a rant, and I'll leave it up to the individual reader to figure out the mental state of the writer, my views are well known. It looks awfully like you actually want to be more to blame than you actually are, which is indicative of a Messianic complex. It's also at odds with your earlier words "but none of us feel any guilt". Unless, of course, you are see yourself as being in some way different - something which sets you apart - from everyone else {"but none of us feel any guilt"}. None of us except you? Pull the other one..

BR wrote:
Revolution may include some pain - that is what I attempted to show.


No it isn't. Your thread announced that there had been a "fantastic riot". What you attempted to show is self evident, you needed to add nothing to the thread title. Are you telling us that you meant something else by your thread title?


BR wrote:
[quote]People have been killed and imprisoned for trying to make the world a better place. Today the students tried to do that - I salute them and back them and believe in them.[quote]


In what way was the world made a better place today? You claim that you "salute them and back them and believe in them". Who? The body of people with no mandate from the original protest's organisers who engaged in uncivilised and destructive behaviour, smashing and injuring their way into tomorrow's headlines?
Or the NUS who organised the original protest and have distanced themselves from those individuals who you, by extension, think are "fantastic".


BR wrote:
We should all do that because they are our future.

You're asking me {for instance} to support people who go about getting their own way by rioting, smashing windows and hospitalising people? That's not progrees, and it's certainly no pointer to a brighter future. It looks rather like mob rule to me.

BR wrote:
Kids are generally good and then get corrupted by life and society and the state. Let's try and give them a good future.

No, let's encourage them to achieve things by honest application, diligence, thoughtfulness, consideration and civilisation.
As opposed to smashing things and hurting people.
 
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Last Edit: 2010/11/11 08:40 By Locked Out.
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#64853
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
Innocent Accused wrote:
One minute you're supporting the coalition heart and soul,the next supporting students rioting against the very cuts they introduced.

The major revolutions in history often achieved quite tragic results.
The Russian revolution of 1917 ushered in a government that managed to murder even more people than Hitler!
The French revolution of 1789 soon turned into Robespierre's Guillotine and Nappy's single handed(well armed lol) devastation of the whole continent of europe.
Solidarity and the Berlin wall were far more peaceful,and were not involved in violence.

Be very careful what you wish for,often the desired result is far different to what you hoped for.


Reminds me of 1997 and the false dawn of 'Saint' Tony Blair and his 'Noo' Labour team, determined to put this country back on the map. What did it do? The entire opposite and made us despised and hated worldwide.
 
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#64854
BR

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
IA you are right - I voted in Blair and we killed a million Iraquis and Afganis.

However, the democracy introduced after the French Revolution was good - and in Russia many millions had died in the unjust wars of the Tsars in the 19th century - so you have to put it into perspective against the full picture and not in isolation.

Solidarity was a violent campaign - many lost their lives and more lost their jobs. They went on strike and many starved as well. Poland was part of the Soviet bloc and they dealt firmly with dissenters.

The ANC saw many deaths in South Africa.

I support the idea of cutting waste and surely it makes sense to sack one Lawyer on £100K a year rather than make 30 students pay an extra £3k a year for their education. Why not sack two Policemen for £100K likewise. We would not have riots if these cuts were fair.

In addition deal with immigrant fraud which costs us millions rather than take housing benefit away from the poorest people in Central London where a shoebox flat can cost £500 a week for a family and £400 is now the limit thus making these people either homeless or pushing them out into the home counties thus raising the prices out there and pushing others out until we see mass migration to the North and Scotland.

These policies are flawed. They were not mentioned in the Manifesto either.

Already they have pulled back on many of the things we applauded them for on this forum. Things like the ANON status for all people accused of sex offences especially teachers - they were going to get rid of the DNA database - but both these things have not been done yet. We see no progress on many of the civil liberties issues. Only ID Cards have been killed.

I still hope the Co-alition can turn this around - but the public need to be forthright in their condemnation of the bad policy, We have had 13 awful years under New Labour. We dont need any more social engineering and we dont need anymore upheaval. We need stability and rationisation of resoureces. The poor must be looked after and COAXED back into jobs - not forced and threatened - threats never work - they just alienate.

We need to cut our overseas army and get out of Afganistan. That was the plan - so why are we still there ? that would save a couple of billion each year. More than enough for students and housing benefit.
 
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#64856
veritas

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
JK2006 wrote:
Well I have mixed feelings. I'm pleased that young people have at last woken up to the fact that they should express an opinion. Since the 60s, when we protested day and night (It's Good News Week) young people seem mired in apathy. I'm sad, though, that it's only selfishness that has provoked reaction. Me Me Me. No "stop being beastly towards victims of false allegations" banners in Trafalgar Square. Just "don't take away MY money".

That's essentially it.

I'm pleased to see healthy demos and that there are some young who are passionate. I don't like the violence but sometimes there is no other recourse.

BR is right though-all these cuts are going to be very damaging not just for those receiving them but they will set up a chain of very unpleasant events.

A simple few percentage points of a tax on the banks and the rich corporations would solve the mess.

It's pretty clear that the only difference between Nu Labour and the Tories now is that both look after corporations first but Labour still throw some morsels to what was once their constituency.

Both parties are a sham though-full of idiots with no new or adventurous ideas.

Remember to say goodbye to that other great party the Lib Dems who have about 3 years left in them before they disappear.
 
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#64862
BR

Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
Veritas is right.

The Liberals are electoral history because they have shown that they can lie with the rest of them.

Clegg should tell Cameron to rethink his policies on

1. FEES - abolish them completely and ask the banks to cover the fees through their profits to invest in the future of the UK seeing as we loaned the banking system nearly a trillion of OUR money when they were in trouble. Fair deal.

2. HOUSING BENEFIT - scrap these artificial ceilings and judge each case on its merits based on local prices. So if the area is cheap then choose the average rental price as the median and if it is expensive like London do the same. That is only fair again.

3. UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFIT - help those who are long term unemployed with PROPER PAID JOBS that dont undermine their benefits. If they get less working then that cant be right - it means the minimum wage is too low - so raise it until it is far better than benefit. You cant cut benefit any more it is already too low to live on for most people - especially those without children.

In terms of the cuts to services :

Cut the FAT CATS not the services for the old and the poor. Surely that is the CARING BIG SOCIETY that we all voted for ? CAMERON has to show that he really believes in what he has said - or like BLAIR we will get rid of him - but this time SOONER because we have all had enough of politicians lies and deceit and expense troughing - the public have zero respect for Politicians now and they have to earn their respect.

I wanted to give CAMERON and CLEGG a chance - they talked a good game. But when the chips are down they are doing the SAME POLICIES as Blair and Brown - these policies are dictated by BIG BUSINESS ( THE NWO run multi-nationals )

We can all see now that OBAMA and the UK PMs are just "Puppet Governments" of the CORPORATIONS. That is now ( Prunella !! ) a FACT
 
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#64863
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
I always found the problem with many student 'activists' is that they had 'fun' protesting. Now, I'm a staunch puritan about politics: it's basically the opposite of sex - if you're enjoying it, you're doing it wrong. Aristotle didn't regard politics as action, he regarded it as 'correct' action, and he appreciated that arriving at something that seemed to be 'correct' was damned hard work. Protests shouldn't be Jolly Boys' outings. Those idiots yesterday were merely indulging in a costly and violent act of public onanism.
 
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#64865
Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago  
Spot on Pru; children always enjoy smashing things up and that tiny gang of ruthless morons always love going too far; using the genuine protesters in order to malign the principle.

It never works; always has a backlash. Often that is the intention.
 
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