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Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS
TOPIC: Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS
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Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago
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BR wrote:
So protesting against unfairness is wrong >
What about SOLIDARITY in Poland ?
They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital
BR wrote:
What about the people who stood on the Berlin Wall ?
They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital
BR wrote:
What about those who protested against the Tsars in 1917 ?
They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital
BR wrote:
What about the French in 1789 who helped to create democracy ?
They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital. Mind you, they did kill a lot of people while those you call "chavs" looked on in fascinated glee.
BR wrote:
What about the suffrajets {sic}in the early part of the 20th century ?
They were representative of a majority and accomplished more than a few broken windows and ten people in hospital
BR wrote:
What about Nelson Mandela in South AFrica ?
You're not serious?
BR wrote:
Many of you seem to forget change from evil often is accompanied by personal sacrifice.
But not by smashing windows and hospitalising ten people....
BR wrote:
Jesus himself died after turning over the tables in the Temple.
I don't recall him smashing the windows, though. Or hospitalising anyone.
BR wrote:
So if you say I am anti State - then you are right. The "state" is by definition evil and supports the rich against the "slave class" History shows us this.
It shows us nothing of the sort. Unless, of course, you're a simpleton with a very narrow view.
BR wrote:
In 21st Century surely it is time to dismantle the state and get rid of the Police ( who only antagonise the public - try ringing them for help and you wont get any ) and the other apparatus which you have been brainwashed into believing actually is necessary.
Ah, the brainwashing thing. I wondered when that would come up. Getting rid of the police would, I'm sure, be very convenient for you personally. Although I doubt very much whether you'd be quite so keen when the law of the jungle replaced the law of the land.
BR wrote:
What is necessary is EDUCATION and DOCTORS and CARE for the ill - weak and vulnerable. Those who fight wars ( states ) are evil - they in my view represent the Devil's hold on our world. Without "states" we would have no war - and therefore people could work to eradicate poverty and disease. That is what we should be working towards surely ? That is a positive vision of the future - rather than one filled with tanks and nuclear warheads and violent clashes on the streets because the Government has spent all the money on the rich banksters so now has to raid the piggy banks of the children in society.
So who's going to ensure the freedoms of the citizens of this little Utopia of yours? You've abolished the state which would fund the institutions necessary to provide the healthcare and education. And you've abolished the police who offer the only line of defence against those who would otherwise rob, kill, and rape them. This latest posting of yours demonstrates an escalation in your condition. I've begged you before to get help. I'd only urge you once again to do so.
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Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago
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BR wrote:
I dont disagree with you LO. I can see the logic in your statements. However, it is a fact that most revolutions are not bloodless.
You might not disagree with me, but I certainly disagree with you. Profoundly. And may I remind you that here we are not talking about revolutions. Your thread concerns today's riot, and your use of the word "fantastic" to describe what the organisers have condemned with utter disgust.
BR wrote:
I am a Christian and I look to the Bible for inspiration.
Where in the Bible is the advice {or "inspiration"} offered to smash windows and hospitalise people?
BR wrote:
Nationalism and States are a modern invention. Prior to this people basically were territorial but did not organise themselves in a Nation State which did not start until the last 200 years.
A fascinating take on history. I'm sure that Octavian Caesar would have loved your insight into what Pax Romana was conceived and executed in order to achieve.
BR wrote:
[quote]Therefore, I truly believe that we dont need "enforcers" like the Police and Army - because peer pressure and values are surely enough to organise society.[quote]
True, true, all those independent minded people pre 1810 didn't feel the need for armies or judges or magistrates or thief-takers, did they? You lived in someone else's land and they owned you lock, stock and barrell. That's why there were no uprisings, insurgencies, rebellions, civil unrests or wars back then. Where do you get this stuff from?
BR wrote:
Drugs and arms running are new things as well. They have grown up because of the nation state - and the police spend most of their time dealing with organised crime.
Are you seriously suggesting that there was no trade in armaments and other weapons of war before 1810? If there was a shortage of strategic and tactical strike weapons that's hardly surprising. But what they lacked in hardware they made up for very enthusiastically in manpower, and mercenaries were well paid and extremely common.
Chemical narcotics are obviously a modern invention, but a trade in the more "natural" variety is, perhaps, the second oldest in the world and you're an idiot if you believe that the widespread use and availability of these drugs wasn't a fact of historical life.
It's also interesting that in your attempts to paint this rosy view of the world before "the last 200 years" you fail to remember that these nations-but-not-states indulged in genocide of a horrendous nature {your own dear churches inquisitions, witch hunts {why were they any better than today's - which you yourself are always shrieking about but, at least, don't result in hangings or burnings?}, and the enforced acquisition of land. How about the Conquistadors and the horrific fate of the Incas? And while we're at it, honourable mention must also be made of those who traded in human beings as if they were no more than a couple of hundred pounds of tea? You thinks drug smuggling is in some way worse than slavery? What a strange, twisted and - above all - utterly confused person you are.
BR wrote:
Laws are passed not to ensure safety - but to ensure money for the Justice System. Under Sharia Law and other older types of law things were more simple - modern law is basically built on technicalities which means ordinary people have no idea what is going on ( Ask Innocent Accused who kept posting on here about how crazy things were in his trial and ask JK who found everything moving like jelly in his trial(s) because he could disprove the orginal charges )
Now you're going off on one again. There's much more to the conception, draughting and enactment of Law than you are suggesting here.
The view you present here is simplistic and funamentally ill conceived.
BR wrote:
We live in a very corrupt world
Had you left it there you'd have done yourself a favour, for there's certainly no arguing with that. However, you spoil what began well by continuing;
BR wrote:
- in 200 years time people will look back and ask why we put up with such awful corruption and such brainwashing and such things.
Which, of course, is your usual and hackneyed "brainwashing" routine. The wording, by the way, makes it look like you are becoming more than a little hysterical at this point.
BR wrote:
I truly believe that eventually the "people" will come through and society will become decent and fair.
You do? When has this ever been true of mankind? Why would human nature change that much?
BR wrote:
At the moment we are in the thrall of big business and we are pumped every day with adverts and media campaigns via news to "conform" and to be basically "slaves" to this system.
*Gasp*. I agree with {almost} every word of that. Except I'd substitute the word "conform" for "consume". Otherwise, just this once, you're right on the money.
BR wrote:
We killed hundreds of thousands in Iraq
I know.
BR wrote:
- but none of us feel any guilt
We Don't?
BR wrote:
( do you >? )
Actually, I do. That you admit that you don't is something that perhaps as a Christian you should be thinking about. From where in your precious Bible do you draw the inspiration for such a breathtaking lack of compassion? It's possible, of course, that you don't actually mean this, and we'll have a look at that in a minute.
BR wrote:
yet your tax and my tax paid to kill those people. Yes - you and I paid to kill innocent people in Iraq. We agreed to killing children and women and men who had done us no wrong. Is that right ? We pretend to ourselves that "we" are not involved because BLAIR and the ARMY did the deed - but we paid for it and we voted for Blair and it is blood on our hands. We cant escape that - we did it.
We pretend that we have no blame - that our Government has nothing to do with us - but by sitting idly by and letting it do these things we are not better than the Nazis.
I recognise how BAD we all are - I recognise how my words of peace mean nothing when our UK Army is killing people in my name in Afganistan this very day. That is wrong, God says to me that it is wrong, It is wrong to kill - it is wrong for me to let my Government kill in my name.
That is why I am anti State. The State commits crime - in my name and is supported by a criminal police force and an army that they force to kill in my name.
I have strong Christian beliefs and it makes me physically sick to see the pain and suffering my country does in my name and the way in which we harass the weak and the poor. That is not what Jesus said that should happen. We should be taking care of the weak and loving our enemies. That is Christianity. Not bombing and killing and making people pay for education whilst bailing out the stinking rich.
That is why I support the kids out there who want a future. Their innocent idealism is something to love - something to believe in - maybe they can create a better world. We should be investing in them - believing in them - not putting them into debt slavery for 10s of years.
By tying them to debt at 18 years old we are going to create generations of people who see work as slavery to the state. That is not the way to educate. The way to educate is by showing these people that money is not important - it is a means - not an end. That living life generously and living to love is the way to live.
That was quite a rant, and I'll leave it up to the individual reader to figure out the mental state of the writer, my views are well known. It looks awfully like you actually want to be more to blame than you actually are, which is indicative of a Messianic complex. It's also at odds with your earlier words "but none of us feel any guilt". Unless, of course, you are see yourself as being in some way different - something which sets you apart - from everyone else {"but none of us feel any guilt"}. None of us except you? Pull the other one..
BR wrote:
Revolution may include some pain - that is what I attempted to show.
No it isn't. Your thread announced that there had been a "fantastic riot". What you attempted to show is self evident, you needed to add nothing to the thread title. Are you telling us that you meant something else by your thread title?
BR wrote:
[quote]People have been killed and imprisoned for trying to make the world a better place. Today the students tried to do that - I salute them and back them and believe in them.[quote]
In what way was the world made a better place today? You claim that you "salute them and back them and believe in them". Who? The body of people with no mandate from the original protest's organisers who engaged in uncivilised and destructive behaviour, smashing and injuring their way into tomorrow's headlines?
Or the NUS who organised the original protest and have distanced themselves from those individuals who you, by extension, think are "fantastic".
BR wrote:
We should all do that because they are our future.
You're asking me {for instance} to support people who go about getting their own way by rioting, smashing windows and hospitalising people? That's not progrees, and it's certainly no pointer to a brighter future. It looks rather like mob rule to me.
BR wrote:
Kids are generally good and then get corrupted by life and society and the state. Let's try and give them a good future.
No, let's encourage them to achieve things by honest application, diligence, thoughtfulness, consideration and civilisation.
As opposed to smashing things and hurting people.
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Last Edit: 2010/11/11 08:40 By Locked Out.
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Re:Fantastic Student Riots against the UNFAIR CUTS 14 Years, 8 Months ago
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Veritas is right.
The Liberals are electoral history because they have shown that they can lie with the rest of them.
Clegg should tell Cameron to rethink his policies on
1. FEES - abolish them completely and ask the banks to cover the fees through their profits to invest in the future of the UK seeing as we loaned the banking system nearly a trillion of OUR money when they were in trouble. Fair deal.
2. HOUSING BENEFIT - scrap these artificial ceilings and judge each case on its merits based on local prices. So if the area is cheap then choose the average rental price as the median and if it is expensive like London do the same. That is only fair again.
3. UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFIT - help those who are long term unemployed with PROPER PAID JOBS that dont undermine their benefits. If they get less working then that cant be right - it means the minimum wage is too low - so raise it until it is far better than benefit. You cant cut benefit any more it is already too low to live on for most people - especially those without children.
In terms of the cuts to services :
Cut the FAT CATS not the services for the old and the poor. Surely that is the CARING BIG SOCIETY that we all voted for ? CAMERON has to show that he really believes in what he has said - or like BLAIR we will get rid of him - but this time SOONER because we have all had enough of politicians lies and deceit and expense troughing - the public have zero respect for Politicians now and they have to earn their respect.
I wanted to give CAMERON and CLEGG a chance - they talked a good game. But when the chips are down they are doing the SAME POLICIES as Blair and Brown - these policies are dictated by BIG BUSINESS ( THE NWO run multi-nationals )
We can all see now that OBAMA and the UK PMs are just "Puppet Governments" of the CORPORATIONS. That is now ( Prunella !! ) a FACT 
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