.." the song must be three minutes long or under"...

The cymbal ring at the end of ours makes it last 3.04 on our timer. Does that disqualify it, or are there concessions for dynamics?

Each country has its own rules Mart and the overall rules have really collapsed since my day (when we brought in backing tracks and phone voting).

But I think the 3 minute rule is pretty strict.
Fade faster!

I'm in two minds about the three minute rule.

One part of me thinks that it's long out of date and that things like "You've Lost That Lovin' Feelin'" (3:54) or "Bohemian Rhapsody" (5:55) would never have had a chance.

But then the majority of the sixties classics, from the Beatles to Motown, had no problem coming in at three minutes sub so does that reflect a general decline in concise songwriting?

(I note that "Crazy" by Gnarls B comes in at three minutes exactly but can't think of many other recent records which do the same apart from some dance ones)

Personally I think 2 minutes is quite long enough (check out 75% of my tracks) and think Eurovision would benefit from a change - after 2 mins the joke begins to wear thin and if it's a hit, you simply play it again, Sam.

Mart, you could argue that the song itself is 3 minutes. The symbol is just an accessory.

Might work.

We have clocked half a verse from it, it works ok, that makes 2.44.
I`m not taking the final explosion off though, it`s too much fun!

I can confirm the rule is very strict. Three minutes maximum. Plenty of longer songs have won their national finals, but they have to be pruned for the actual contest.

I think three minutes is about right. Some songs, usually the more quirky ones would work at two minutes, but I think a serious ballad, for example, needs longer than that to do itself justice.

Your help is most appreciated Anthony.
We intend to see you there next year but are pushing for an entry at this time firstly.
Any help and advice is appreciated, we really think we have a fun cracker of a tunette here.
The debate here is do we change the vocalist or not? (he may be not that fit )and that is all the clues you get!

Re, the "3 minute song" in general, which seems to apply everywhere, how tiresome in this day and age it is becoming, recording works and looking at the clock on the console.
Sometimes, you just want to let an artist get on with it and relax, but you can`t, as they won`t be played anywhere.
That said, how many "Bohemian Rhapsody`s" and "Stairways to heaven" do we get anymore?
We all look at the timings of a tune and think, "I`ll check it out later!" if it looks too long.

Happy to help at any time. I have nothing to do with the music industry, but I do know my stuff in the weird specialised world of Eurovision!

As for the vocalist, it really depends on the song. Russia wouldn't have won this year with an ageing "unfit" artist, but other songs might actually benefit from a performer somewhat different from the stereotype.

Cheers Anthony.
I have just listened again to the first mix and am changing my tack on this rather.
Can one of you guys make sure that I am in touch with the right people?..as I think we have a winning song here and I do have the right guys to do this .
I apologise for meandering around on the message board on this subject, but I do believe it has helped create exactly what ,me, (as a writer wot cart spell innit!), wanted.

Entry form somebody?????

Can't be much help on that question, Mart. The BBC didn't make any public announcement I was aware of, about entries for last year's contest. I'm not sure they even had a fully open competition.

Best contact the BBC direct. Head of Light Entertainment or their Press Office maybe.

The problem is Mart... when I took over and, I'm sure, one of the reasons we won was that I had a foot in both camps (ooh matron) knowing both the music and the TV worlds.

I also insisted on full control, ably assisted in all matters BBC by Kevin Bishop (who remains a good friend) and Mike Leggo (my ex researcher from Ent USA).

So everyone knew who to contact, who to go through, who to ask about rules and so on.

It was my idea (in fact, I paid) to put out free sampler CDs of clips of the finalists via all good retailers (are there any left?), so fans could listen more than once before voting.

I was then an expert on all the rules; As I said, I even changed a couple (thanks to Kevin's power at the EBU).

And I took full blame for our failures with Love City Groove and Gina G - and was in due course given full credit for our win with Katrina.

I made sure singles were available for purchase, deals were done with labels, chart positions acquired, airplay given, press covered it and so on.

It was great fun and I loved doing it but I do think the secret is ONE PERSON in charge. Sadly the BBC are aware of the flak they would get from the tabloids if I took over again (otherwise I'm sure they'd hand it back to me).