We now know this was and remains a trivial virus for 95% of those that get it but very nasty indeed for the vulnerable (those near death, elderly, ill) and pretty unpleasant for many who get it mildly yet suffer side effects (happened to me, I think; aching hip etc). Of course it's not "a hoax". I don't think it was "a plan" - I'm no conspiracy theorist.

I've felt from the start this was a media inflated story (media only wants a great story); believed in by global governments instead of getting properly examined. As a result - over reacted. Things like trying to control the spread can help (as with Flu; fewer people catch it) but common sense ought to be the rule; of course, as it's often asymptomatic, harder to avoid than Flu which has clear symptoms but as a result - greater care and protection of the vulnerable MUST be taken (avoid contact with fat people, smokers, the old etc).

And, as we're learning about it, it's clear the "long tail" is very unpleasant and we need to treat not just Covid sufferers but to improve our care of those whose previous weaknesses require medication.

Total lockdown was a serious mistake. Getting a vaccine is vital. Sensible protection and treatment is and was essential (I think the Death Five ignoring care homes was the cause of the inflated death cases).

I would only get the vaccine if Bill Gates and ALL the world leaders take it first.

I'm a (converted) fan of vaccines; l had the Flu jab for years now and it's been brilliant. Was the first to get the new Flu jab in London in September; also had the pneumonia jab. I'll get the Cover jab the moment it's here.

I'm sorry but hearing "experts" and "ministers" talk about "test & trace" and the "Nightingales" and other aspects - they KEEP saying "we must slow the second wave" - nobody asks WHY??? Look at France - several weeks ahead of the UK; still hardly any deaths or serious cases in the "second wave". Why over react? Why cause panic? Why cause economic & social misery for a different kind of flu?

I think it is because they have built everything on the r number. The lockdowns have been "justified" on this. They have been doing this for so long now that to do otherwise means admitting they got it wrong and all the misery now and coming (through lockdown) is actually their responsibility rather than somehow inevitable.

This is about careers.

They are terrified of Sweden...

JK2006 wrote:
I'm a (converted) fan of vaccines; l had the Flu jab for years now and it's been brilliant. Was the first to get the new Flu jab in London in September; also had the pneumonia jab. I'll get the Cover jab the moment it's here.


The three main vaccines recommended by the NHS for adults are the pneumoccal, 'flu and shingles ones.

Apart from those required by babies/young people, those in at-risk categories and those travelling abroad.

So I was told by the nurse at my local surgery when having the 'flu jab again, earlier this month.

Yes nobody got it totally right - Sweden didn't protect care homes enough. New Zealand ruined the economy and tourism by unnecessarily tight lockdown. Germany did very well considering a new virus with new problems. But you're right wyot. Any decent PM (or President or dictator or communist) would say - "hold on; the effects of this virus are changing; we need to treat it differently now, whether or not we made mistakes in the past".

Look at the figures of cases when sorted by ethnicity.
If we had the political will and courage to be honest about this, and concentrate restriction and isolation on those groups who display significantly higher numbers of cases than others we would be in a far better position.

I will post the link to the report if requested

So tiering and restriction by ethnicity not geography Paul? Is this to protect "us" from "them" or "them" from "themselves"? I'm unclear.

I forsee some practical challenges. I have an Indian neighbour. Would he be able to still pop to the pub with me (we are a Tier 1 area but I understand he will be a Tier 3 individual?) as it doesn't sell food? Can he stay until 10am if he is allowed out at all?

But I guess I can stay till 11pm as restrictions are about individuals now right? Great news.

Oh I am 100% White British by way sorry should have cleared that up. Which is a good point: we will need "ethnicity certificates" to prove we are allowed out. It is not always obvious, you know.

My neighbour's wife is mixed race (Indian/White British). I can't give you the exact percentage breakdown of her heritage, as I understand there has been further historical miscegination within her family.

How will the pub work for her? And will her two children (Tier 2, 3 or 1 and a half?) be allowed to continue to mix with mine (also 100% White British) at their local school?

Thanks in advance.

If we're going to start protecting the vulnerable (I think the current word is shielding) I fit into two categories; I'm old and diabetic. However I'm not either overweight or a past smoker. Once you add in ethnicity and skin colour, much of the population needs shielding (don't forget diet, religion, sexuality etc) you might as well just call it lockdown.

JK2006 wrote:
Once you add in ethnicity and skin colour

Isn't this what scientists have been trying to do for years with genetics research. An the investigations into the human genome.

All races have different characteristics which cannot be ignored, and Paul quoted some relevant stats in his post on another thread.

How it'll happen, I don't know. But here's another interesting fact.

Of Native Americans, 16% have disabilities: 4% of Asians have. As of now, nobody knows why, but the research is ongoing.

Paul in Wales wrote:
Look at the figures of cases when sorted by ethnicity.
If we had the political will and courage to be honest about this, and concentrate restriction and isolation on those groups who display significantly higher numbers of cases than others we would be in a far better position.

I will post the link to the report if requested


Are students an ethnic group now?

No. Of course not
Why do you ask?
But if for every 20 cases in white population there is 160 within the Pakistani community throughout England,where should we be targeting quarantine etc?
And a significant number of Pakistani people don't go to the pub!

The pub was just an example of the absurdities and impossibilities caused by the suggestion of restrictions by ethnicity. There would also be riots.

It has been known for a long time about the divergent effect of Covid across ethnicity. But there are many individual risk factors that cross ethnicity: where would it end?

I don't want restrictions by geography either.