So the BBC do a huge tribute after his death and it is very touching - he was clearly a decent man. But people of 100 DO die (he died from pneumonia). I'm not against tributes to dead people. I'm not against such TV and media. But I am horrified by media simply trying to continue the stupid, irresponsible drive towards making Covid19, a trivial virus for most, into their "killer plague" which they have sold since Day One as the great story to sell papers and get ratings.

And the hidden implication, that people who die NOT connected to Covid, do not matter, neither do grieving friends and relatives, is nasty.

I love the media. I'm in the media. Media made me everything I am. But by God it can be wicked, evil when irresponsible. I don't blame governments and gullibles who fall for it (that's why those of us, who know how to manipulate it, do so). I don't blame owners or shareholders. It's their job to increase profits and most are too stupid to see repercussions. I blame the bosses - Editors, Producers, CEO's. They are, simply, bad at their jobs and have no sense of human responsibility.

It was covid. He already had pneumonia and was treated for a while in hospital, where they gave him covid. He returned home, developed symptoms, was re-admitted and died.

3.1 million children die a year from malnutrition:

www.express.co.uk/news/world/1391034/sou...war-3-latest-ont/amp

We pick our stories for our own reasons. Perhaps this one is just too awful for us to start thinking about; or just too unremarkable.

So we (the press and us) get hysterical about Covid, or a man of 100 dying. Easier. Simpler.

Wyot wrote:
3.1 million children die a year from malnutrition:

www.express.co.uk/news/world/1391034/sou...war-3-latest-ont/amp

We pick our stories for our own reasons. Perhaps this one is just too awful for us to start thinking about; or just too unremarkable.

So we (the press and us) get hysterical about Covid, or a man of 100 dying. Easier. Simpler.

Not to take away from other injustices, of course, but we SHOULD be hysterical when the national health service, who we are supposed to clap for, keeps passing coronavirus onto patients and killing them.

Honey wrote:
[quote]Wyot wrote:


Not to take away from other injustices, of course, but we SHOULD be hysterical when the national health service, who we are supposed to clap for, keeps passing coronavirus onto patients and killing them.

But is the NHS doing this Honey? Is there data? There has always been a risk of picking up infections in hospitals (mrsa?). Short of treating everyone at home, hospitals will inevitably "harvest" viruses.

Is there any evidence that the NHS is falling short of what can realistically be done in terms of hygiene?

I stepped in a NHS hospital yesterday. Nothing but protocol and paranoia on masks etc. I couldn’t even grab a drink and snack without following arrows despite no one else in the hospital shop.

Wyot wrote:
[quote]Honey wrote:
Wyot wrote:


Not to take away from other injustices, of course, but we SHOULD be hysterical when the national health service, who we are supposed to clap for, keeps passing coronavirus onto patients and killing them.

But is the NHS doing this Honey? Is there data? There has always been a risk of picking up infections in hospitals (mrsa?). Short of treating everyone at home, hospitals will inevitably "harvest" viruses.

Is there any evidence that the NHS is falling short of what can realistically be done in terms of hygiene?

I am afraid they really are doing this, Wyot. www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&sa=X&...AhXRVRUIHUeoCvcQPAgH

Bear in mind this only shows those presumably infected by hospital admissions and not those who were breathed on by gormless GP receptionists, or at outpatients.

But never mind the statistics- they are usually meaningless.
What makes me so sure is that I have seen repeatedly over the last year ( Four hospitals, one GP surgery, two clinics) nurses not only not wearing the masks and not cleaning their hands after contamination, but getting shirty with people for taking precautions and refusing point blank to pull the bloody mask up.

Honey the link doesn't work for me. I wonder though if the hospital Covid infections are compared with usual rates of infections for other viruses in hospital? Or is Covid again examined out of context and in isolation as it is everywhere else? I.e is covid being picked up at the same rate as other bugs in hospitals and can hospitals do more?

Your anecdotal experience of hospitals and Covid precautions is the polar opposite to mine. I have been surprised I was allowed to breathe in my local hospitals last year!!

Wyot wrote:
Honey the link doesn't work for me. I wonder though if the hospital Covid infections are compared with usual rates of infections for other viruses in hospital? Or is Covid again examined out of context and in isolation as it is everywhere else? I.e is covid being picked up at the same rate as other bugs in hospitals and can hospitals do more?

Your anecdotal experience of hospitals and Covid precautions is the polar opposite to mine. I have been surprised I was allowed to breathe in my local hospitals last year!!

Maybe this is why infections are still sky high in my area and low in yours?

One thing that really might be making a difference in infection rates is the culture here (North west) to be offended at hygiene.
For instance, someone will be offended if you antibac after shaking their hand, or will sneer if they see you operating the lift button with your elbow and recite bollocks such as germs are good for the immune system etc. (it really doesn't work like that ) and if you ask the checkout girl to please not lick her fingers to open your carrier bag they will declare that they have no germs.
It makes me want to beat either their heads or my own against the wall!

Honey wrote:
I have seen repeatedly over the last year ( Four hospitals, one GP surgery, two clinics) nurses not only not wearing the masks and not cleaning their hands after contamination, but getting shirty with people for taking precautions and refusing point blank to pull the bloody mask up.


I disagree with your view and agree with Wyot - and have only seen the highest of standards in a number of medical centres and hospitals.

Laschet wrote:
Honey wrote:
I have seen repeatedly over the last year ( Four hospitals, one GP surgery, two clinics) nurses not only not wearing the masks and not cleaning their hands after contamination, but getting shirty with people for taking precautions and refusing point blank to pull the bloody mask up.


I disagree with your view and agree with Wyot - and have only seen the highest of standards in a number of medical centres and hospitals.



I am truly glad that yours and Wyot's hospitals appear to be safe.
A lot of the reasons the infection rate is high in hospitals are outside the control of the nursing staff, who I am sure are mostly doing the best they can, and of course, they are at extremely high risk themselves.
There is nothing these people can do about their buildings, their overcrowding, or their poor protection, but the actions of a few who are sloppy with hygiene has terrible consequences, and this is the one thing that can be controlled.

I don't know why you feel the need to register your disagreement though, Barney. Our experiences are all different and equally valid. The more we hear, the more likely we are to get the full picture.

www.hsj.co.uk/patient-safety/covid-infec...week/7029320.article

Honey wrote:
One thing that really might be making a difference in infection rates is the culture here (North west) to be offended at hygiene.
For instance, someone will be offended if you antibac after shaking their hand, or will sneer if they see you operating the lift button with your elbow and recite bollocks such as germs are good for the immune system etc. (it really doesn't work like that ) and if you ask the checkout girl to please not lick her fingers to open your carrier bag they will declare that they have no germs.
It makes me want to beat either their heads or my own against the wall!

There may be a difference there Honey. People around here seem to me to have gone to the other extremes of almost OCD behaviours about it. I know several people who won't even order a takeaway anymore...Covid could have been breathed on it!!

Wyot wrote:
Honey wrote:
One thing that really might be making a difference in infection rates is the culture here (North west) to be offended at hygiene.
For instance, someone will be offended if you antibac after shaking their hand, or will sneer if they see you operating the lift button with your elbow and recite bollocks such as germs are good for the immune system etc. (it really doesn't work like that ) and if you ask the checkout girl to please not lick her fingers to open your carrier bag they will declare that they have no germs.
It makes me want to beat either their heads or my own against the wall!

There may be a difference there Honey. People around here seem to me to have gone to the other extremes of almost OCD behaviours about it. I know several people who won't even order a takeaway anymore...Covid could have been breathed on it!!

You wouldn't know there was a pandemic round here if it wasn't for the pubs being shut.