young unarmed Iraqi teenagers. British soldiers even videoing the beatings for their own entertainment.

Britain must be so proud of 'our brave boys'.

nm

Notice how quick John Reid was to come out and say "the ground is not even" in defence of these terror-bullies?

No - the ground isn;t even - the Yankers have all the weapons and are illegally occupying someone else's country!

Despite all that the people will never be defeated. The Yanks have short memories - at the very start of this I dubbed it "Viet-Iraq"

My view is, there's nothing to defeat, and there's nothing at all to win. A war on terrorism is a bit like fighting a war on shoplifting !

If somebody climbed uninvited into your backyard, you are within your rights to get them to leave using reasonable force, they do not have the right to attack YOU.

I'm not defending the attacks on the Iraqis, it is obviously out of order. However they were strongly provoked by having rocks thrown at them. There are 2 sides to every story. If you can't take it, then don't give it out.

Yeah well Kids throwing rocks should get some retribution of some sort. You can't just go around throwing rocks at people and not expect any come back.

I didn't say it was ok, but that the attacks were not completely unprovoked. I think that the mocking of the cameraman was more shocking. I don't support this war and I don't think most of the soldiers are overjoyed to be out there.

There isn't an armed force anywhere in the world that wouldn't react to having rocks and bottles thrown at them. Most armed forces would have been shooting at those people throwing the stuff in the first place. The British soldiers have been shamelesssy sent there to a job they don't want to do and in a no win situation. Just a tiny handful of them were assaulting those kids and will hopefully be punished for it.The vast majority, 99.9% do their jobs as they are expected to do them and professionally. You don't judge all of the muslim community by the 200 morons in London with the 7/7 placards and threatening to murder and maim, so you can't judge the British forces by the acts of a tiny few soldiers. Compare this to many nations armies who would just shoot anyone throwing rocks and have nobody to answer to for their actions.

The problem with your assertion is that there are now wave after wave of similar incidents - all being suppressed by the MoD.

When does a wave become a torrent?

Just as everything we were ever told about the reasons for invading Iraq have turned out to be a complete pack of lies - these claims that these are isolated incidents simply do not hold water.

First of all,I totally agree with you that the war is a farce and Blair and Bush should be held to account for an illegal invasion based on lies.

Being Irish, I'm hardly qualified to be biased towards the British Military.However,I do believe the British Soldiers are amongst the fairest in the world and don't deserve total condemnation for the act of a tiny minority in what is an impossible situation.I'm as angry as you are that some soldiers have taken it upon themselves to behave so brutally and shamefully and let their nation down in such an appalling way. Unlike many other nations, those soldiers will be dealt with and punished.

Soldiers don't get a choice about where they are sent or how they feel about the situation. Most are ordinary men who are brothers, fathers, sons etc.They have to face daily risks with their lives avoiding ambushes, suicide bombers etc and are largely ill equipped to deal with it.As in every walk of life, you get the small minority who abuse their situation.
Ask yourself these questions below.

Were you just as angry when hundreds of thousands of men, women and children were murdered so violently and gassed under Saddam's rule?
Or when extremists kidnap peace workers and cut their heads off with a saw, then send the videos of the murders to Al Jazeera?
Are you enraged by the Nazi Holocaust?
What about the Turkish massacre of Armenia? Kosovo? Laos?
Are you so angry when Iran executes people for the crime of homosexuality? Or when they execute 15 year old girls for being unfaithful to their husbands (raped)?
Or when Nigerian women are stoned to death in public for being "unfaithful"?

I'm equally angry at all atrocities

As for you suggesting I'm biased and am making assertions....Your posts are not exactly open minded, full of negative assertions and you seem to react in a domineering manner to anyone else who has a point of view, that doesn't agree with your own.

We're all biased at the end of the day and despite how it might seem I do actually agree with 95% of what you say.

First of all,I totally agree with you that the war is a farce and Blair and Bush should be held to account for an illegal invasion based on lies.


We are off to a good start !

Soldiers don't get a choice

Yes they do - they can choose not to join up !

Did they think they were joining the girl guides?

They knew they were puppets - yet still signed up. You cannot have it both ways.