news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7913073.stm

Another of ACPOs latest ploys - mobile ID checks with fingerprinting.

So basically you can be in your front room watching the news or in Tescos shopping - and still get ID checked !!! amazing !!!

But guess what - our very "Non Racist - cough " police use this on possibly 47% Ethnic Minorities ( when the population is 4% ethnic overall ) yet ACPO dont see this as a problem.

ACPO continue to "police" our streets with their ever increasing paraphanalia of "Police State" weaponary and a different approach to policing.

What ACPO dont understand is that the ordinary UK citizen now sees them as a para-government force with no authority legally. They are basically a team of uniformed security guards with no mandate to Police us the people.

No wonder they get such bad press and the general public is now so divorced from the criminal justice system. The Police are the only people you can safely say are less popular than terrorists in society - and I have spoken to many who feel that way who 10 years ago would have considered themselves fans of policing and the police.

I'm married to a plod from Nottingham and sadly 95% of the more serious crime is carried out by ethnic minorities there so 47% seems a fair deal really.

Just wondered what official statistics you use to come to a 95% crime rate by ethnics and a 5% from white UK population. I have seen Nottingham on the TV on Friday and Saturday nights with them all boozing on the streets and fighting.......they were all white in the TV shots that I have seen.

BR wrote:
Just wondered what official statistics you use to come to a 95% crime rate by ethnics and a 5% from white UK population. I have seen Nottingham on the TV on Friday and Saturday nights with them all boozing on the streets and fighting.......they were all white in the TV shots that I have seen.

I said serious crime. I don't know where you come from but being drunk and having a punch up isn't that serious.

Try gun crime or try living in Nottingham for a week. You'll see what I mean. The figures are official and stand at 98.4% on gun crime alone.

95% sounds a very large percentage !

the way stastistcs are counted can make all the difference. I believe there has been a concerted campaign for at least the last 10 years to "demonise" minority ethnic groups-although that doesn't mean they are as pure as driven snow.

I cannot believe any race of people is more, or less, prone to crime than any other but certainly circumstances will drive people to crime.

With large industries and manufacturing closing or moving off-shore we have seen large communities of generations of Brits being demoralised or breaking sown and naturally-these tend to be in the more "working class " areas. Following that we end up with dispossed young people with little prospects of meaningful work, too much time on their hands and prey to destructive elements like drugs or binge drinking.

Smaller ethnic minorities have their own set of destructive circumstances to deal with.

In the end we all suffer. Blame the politicians.

veritas wrote:
95% sounds a very large percentage !

the way stastistcs are counted can make all the difference. I believe there has been a concerted campaign for at least the last 10 years to "demonise" minority ethnic groups-although that doesn't mean they are as pure as driven snow.

I cannot believe any race of people is more, or less, prone to crime than any other but certainly circumstances will drive people to crime.



This is yardie style crime and follows the patterns laid out in Jamaica. More than 75% of the victims are actually Jamaican born. These aren't race crimes as the victim and perpetrator are usually always black. These guys also terrorise the local black community and try and recruit the boys usually with threats and violence.

Compare this to areas such as Wisbech in the Cambridgeshire fens. Since the Eastern europeans came in, there has been a massive increase in car related crime, mostly untaxed and unroadworthy vehicles/driving without a license.

It does seem unfair to stereotype but in many areas you can do it easily.

Sure we have enough scum here already who will be happy to divert the attention on immigrants but you can't deny that when people come from poorer, much more lawless societies, crime comes with them. This is in the same way as Essex went in the 60s and 70s when the Eastenders moved out there.

perhaps you are right...it's not uncommon in any large group of ethnic immigrant minorities to have standover merchants that come from within.

The Italians and Irish had them in New York in the early days-the UK West Indian community in the 60's had Rachman style landlords from their own people.

It takes a lot of time-generations -for stereotyping to break down.

I abhored Enoch Powell's politics (and incidentley he was one of the most learned and intelligent MPs ever)but perhaps there was some truth in his statement that eventually Britain would have future racial problems although I don't think he forsaw what the actual reasons would be.

What shocks me about this story and the link-I hadn't heard of "mobile finger-printing" before !

just amazing..how far will they go ?

Of course the police aren't to blame for these things-they simply implement laws.
.

Of course gun crime seems to be more prevalent in drug dealers areas (which are poor black areas ) so you could say that poverty plays just as big a role as race.

In addition I dont accept that drunk and disordely on High Streets is low level crime. My brother was assaulted and had his face re-arranged whilst taking his children to get some chips - they were white and because they were "known criminals" the police let them off with a slapped wrist and small fine. My brother spent two weeks in hospital and lost two weeks of salary because he runs his own business.

Low level crime is just as bad as gun shootings, IN fact it is more important because it effects MORE of us. I have never seen a gun shooting in my life - but I have seen assaults on streest at night when people have been bludgeoned with baseball bats - and yes those people were football fans ( Arsenal ) on a High Street in London after their team lost beating up Man Utd fans........

In fact I cant remember the last time I saw a BLACK football hooligan ? they are ALL white.

I believe there are "firms" in Nottingham who beat up other fans ( Of Derby etc ) and they are ALL white as well. I have come accross this before whilst talking to friends in Notts. My ex used to be a solicitor in Nottingham..........

I believe the ethnic fingerprinting MAKES a stereotype which is hard for them to break - they are expected to misbehave.

Our country has much worse behaviour than the rest of Europe. Just go out on ANY street tonight in any town. They are ALL white. I dont see any East Europeans rucking in City Centres or Black kids.

I really think you have looked at one area ( Gun crime ) and it is (thankfully ) such a small part of crime - that your 95% is based on that. Crime as a whole is alot less colour blind.

I find astonishing the racism stories about the POLICE in this weeks EVENING STANDARD - where the white police have a van and the ethnic police have a van !!! Shocking apartheid.;

BR wrote:
My brother was assaulted and had his face re-arranged whilst taking his children to get some chips - they were white and because they were "known criminals" the police let them off with a slapped wrist and small fine. My brother spent two weeks in hospital and lost two weeks of salary because he runs his own business.


The Police have no part in whether prosecutions go ahead. The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) does that. The police do all the work, the CPS then look at the likelihood of prosecution and generally drop the charges. I'm surprised someone as learned as you didn't know that.

Of course poverty breeds crime, hence vast amounts of immigrants from poorer countries are going to increase crime significantly, regardless of their colour,

I tend not to go down the "I believe" route and just stick to the areas I know through personal experience.

Until we get representatives of every race and age committing every type of crime, the people targeted will always be disproportionate in one way or another.

I dont see any East Europeans rucking in City Centres or Black kids

This tends to be alcohol related and amongst the yob culture that we already have here. The "Immigrants" tend not to integrate into that culture and usually have their own social clubs But I'd be interested to know how you can identify Latvians and Lithuanians in a group of white British people on CCTV ?

Dont get me started on the CPS. They are based IN police stations. They are inefficient and yes they hamper real policing - everyone DOES know that.

But low level crime is increasing - we have CCTV which shows it happening. But the POLICE choose to prosecute 71 year old skaters and then leave those who assault people and injure them alone. That cant be right.

Why dont the Police revolt against the CPS if they think the CPS are more often wrong than right ?

Why is the justice system in this country so messed up - that it does not benefit the decent people of the UK.

Finally - if you watched the BBC BIG QUESTION this morning you will see that 95% of people now agree that the UK treats its citizens as CRIMINALS first. That is appalling in a free country. They also agree it is WORSE here than it was in EAST GERMANY under the STASI.

We are having our freedoms stripped from us weekly. When the ID card comes in that is the end.

BR wrote:
Dont get me started on the CPS. They are based IN police stations. They are inefficient and yes they hamper real policing - everyone DOES know that.



Once again you're ill informed. The CPS are NOT based inside police stations.

The police investigate the alleged offence. The CPS decide whether to go ahead with the prosecution.In most cases, Crown Prosecutors will decide whether to charge a person with a criminal offence, and will determine the appropriate charge or charges. In those cases where the police determine the charge, which are usually more minor and routine cases, they apply the same principles.

The CPS decide whether or not to prosecute by applying the Code for Crown Prosecutors to the facts of the particular case.

But the POLICE choose to prosecute 71 year old skaters

The police do not prosecute anyone.That's decided by the CPS who are NOT based inside a police station

95% of people now agree that the UK treats its citizens as CRIMINALS first. That is appalling in a free country. They also agree it is WORSE here than it was in EAST GERMANY under the STASI.

Which of course would explain why so many immigrants are so desperate to get here, even walking through the channel tunnel to get from France (with its fantastic tolerant police force) to get into the UK where they risk losing all their rights and being brutalised by a corrupt police force. You've obviously got a hatred of authority of any kind and it's because of the attitude of people like you that the police have such an impossible job.

We are having our freedoms stripped from us weekly. When the ID card comes in that is the end

Yes just like Spain. It made sod all difference to them.
You can always emigrate to a country with nicer policemen and no ID cards ?

I had a similar experience to your brother BR and had my face re-arranged by some white thugs in a largely black populated area.

the people who came to my aid by deciding I wasn't a lolling drunk in the gutter where 2 darling black ladies.

Fortunately it was put back in order despite the doctor at the time asking " wasn't your nose always flattened to the side ?" and the very real risk -as I lay in a semi-coma( and it's true-you can hear what's being said) that I'd probably have severe brain damage. I did lose 50% of the sight in one eye.

At the time-the DC looking into the case was superb.