Greeting Boarders,

I admit I haven't been following this stuff very closely, but when I read the following it put me in mind of some recent discussions here.

"The coalition government has proposed increasing the fees cap from £3,375 to £9,000 from 2013."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11920628

Some posters have suggested that the students are self-interested in their protesting, but if the fees won't go up till 2013, 3 years away, then it's hard to see how any of these protesting students are being narrowly self-interested, since the changes won't affect them personally.

It may be possible to argue that they are self-interested in a broader sense, in that they are pursuing the interests of the group with which they are presently identified, namely students, but already there is a move away from self to other if that is the case. And in that broader sense, all movements for change within British society are self-interested because they are directed towards the betterment of a group with which we all identify, even if that group is the British public. On that broader definition, then, it would be hard ever to escape the charge of self-interest and it seems unfair to pin it on these students.

In any case, it could be argued that the students are acting not just for the good of students, but for the good of the wider society, no matter how you may disagree with their logic. It might well be that what is motivating them is a concern for society as a whole, with particular reference to how it values the life of the mind and ideas in general. Some of the placards support this take, for example, things like "Education is not a commodity", or, "Stop the corporatization of education".

So yes, their could be self-interest, but only if very broadly defined, so broadly that it would include just about all social activism, including, most likely, much that goes on on this board.

Best Wishes,
Jim

Sadly Jim I suspect you over estimate the depth and intelligence of the young; to them this is a personal problem "raising student fees will affect us" and many of the protesters are school age who will indeed be affected or current students with younger brothers and sisters. The words "student" and "money" equal a reason to protest. The words "innocents murdered with our cash" are not selfish enough to complain about.

Jim

Just a thought ....

As NONE of these students will pay ANYTHING upfront and not pay anything back at all until they are earning £21,000 a year, will those that "drop-out" repay the investment that we have voluntarily made in them ?

My Mum paid all my school and University fees. My Cambridge education contributed nothing specific to my earnings - indeed I was the only Oxbridge undergraduate ever to have hits; but it contributed enormously to my life and I'm hugely appreciative of those three happy years.

And by sharpening my brain it definitely helped my ideas for breaking - and making - my hits.

Plus, of course, I would never have met David Gilmour who informs me (correctly - I had forgotten) I was his first record producer - and the world might never have had the eventual Pink Floyd.

Thanks JK, you write:

"[M]any of the protesters are school age who will indeed be affected".

This may be true for school kids or a certain age, say 16 or 17, but what about the remainder of the protesters, surely that vast bulk of them? Is it your position that they are narrowly self-interested because, even though the proposals won't affect them directly, they mistakenly imagine that they will?

I'll grant you this may apply to protesting members of a second rate institution like Cambridge, but even Oxonians were protesting, and I really can't bring myself to believe they are that stupid.

Best Wishes,
Jim

I would say it began as self interest but has become a learning curve.

They are seeing just how awful the cops are now and how basically the whole system is a ramshackle cart heading downhill.

There is a simple solution to this...corporations that hire young graduates should be taxed for the privilege and so the country can re-coup our taxes.

As I type this that awful Phillip Green is on Oz TV with a load of plonkers who all want to be creeps like him.

Sums up Britain's vacuous celebrity culture really. That and those fuckwits up north sticking their heads in bowls with spiders and such