Shocking story -

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-12088871

It was Christmas (and there was no room at the INN?)

Too right as well, its about time these freeloaders were cracked down on. How would you like it if you came home to find a tramp sitting on your sofa, watching your tv. Off course he didn't take anything, he didn't go anywhere to take anything, it was all there in the flat. This story is made even worse by the fact that it was a polish national that was squatting, not only do they come over here take our jobs and depress the wages, but they squat in our houses too....

The real sad part of the story to me is that this country is full of immigrants in the first place.I won't blame anyone for keeping warm,but is this any way to act in a foreign country? What a waste of his time,and our money.We were told the coalition was cracking down on immigration,for reasons like this I assumed,but sadly the EU makes it harder to do the sensible thing.

robbiex wrote:
Too right as well, its about time these freeloaders were cracked down on. How would you like it if you came home to find a tramp sitting on your sofa, watching your tv. Off course he didn't take anything, he didn't go anywhere to take anything, it was all there in the flat. This story is made even worse by the fact that it was a polish national that was squatting, not only do they come over here take our jobs and depress the wages, but they squat in our houses too....

I think I'm even more shocked at the zenophobic comments of posters than I am at the original story.

Innocent Accused wrote:
The real sad part of the story to me is that this country is full of immigrants in the first place.I won't blame anyone for keeping warm,but is this any way to act in a foreign country? What a waste of his time,and our money.We were told the coalition was cracking down on immigration,for reasons like this I assumed,but sadly the EU makes it harder to do the sensible thing.

You currently "blame" the Poles.
Prior to this it was the West Indians, before that the Irish, and the Jews.

We have sent far more people to occupy other parts of the world (Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Rhodesia etc etc) than have ever come here !

When will you take some responsibility for your life .... instead of continually trying to blame someone else ?

well said, ITK.

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
The real sad part of the story to me is that this country is full of immigrants in the first place.I won't blame anyone for keeping warm,but is this any way to act in a foreign country? What a waste of his time,and our money.We were told the coalition was cracking down on immigration,for reasons like this I assumed,but sadly the EU makes it harder to do the sensible thing.

You currently "blame" the Poles.
Prior to this it was the West Indians, before that the Irish, and the Jews.

We have sent far more people to occupy other parts of the world (Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Rhodesia etc etc) than have ever come here !

When will you take some responsibility for your life .... instead of continually trying to blame someone else ?

And when will you stop being an egoistic prat?
If you need to lower yourself into getting personal then you have no place on this board.You've got no friends on here as it is,and you're hardly going about it the right way to improve the situation.

In The Know wrote:
Shocking story -

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-12088871

It was Christmas (and there was no room at the INN?)

If anyone took my house keys (theft) without my permission and stayed in my house whilst I was on holiday, i also would want the thief jailed. Does that make me unreasonable? Isn't that why we have keys, to keep unwanted people out, and isn't that why we have prisons, to jail offenders such as thieves?
It is also notable that for the offence, which carries a maximum of 5 years, he wasgranted bail but could not provide a suitable address, forcing him to stay out his sentence.
To the O/P. Please be sure to leave your keys available to the homeless next time yougo on holiday.

Thanks Anon, you write:

"If anyone took my house keys (theft) without my permission and stayed in my house whilst I was on holiday, i also would want the thief jailed. Does that make me unreasonable?"

Err..yes.

Best Wishes,
Jim

Jim wrote:
Thanks Anon, you write:

"If anyone took my house keys (theft) without my permission and stayed in my house whilst I was on holiday, i also would want the thief jailed. Does that make me unreasonable?"

Err..yes.

Best Wishes,
Jim

I assume you leave your keys out for strangers when going on holiday then? You are a nicer person than I am if that is the case, but that does not make me unreasonable for wishing to lawfully secure my property and for agreeing with punishment for offenders which acts as a deterrent. I suspect you are in the minority. I sincerely hope so.

Innocent Accused wrote:
And when will you stop being an egoistic prat?
If you need to lower yourself into getting personal then you have no place on this board.You've got no friends on here as it is,and you're hardly going about it the right way to improve the situation.

If I have to lower myself to being a zenophobic idiot (in order to obtain clearly ignorant "friends" - then I am sure thay are friends that I do not want !

Anon wrote:
It is also notable that for the offence, which carries a maximum of 5 years, he wasgranted bail but could not provide a suitable address, forcing him to stay out his sentence.
To the O/P. Please be sure to leave your keys available to the homeless next time yougo on holiday.

It's notable that (in the original report) both the police and the complainant have shown "sympathy" for the offender.

Do you think that unreasonable?

Perhaps coming back from holiday and finding him dead on the doorstep (it was -10C!) would have been preferable?

A belated Happy Christmas, to you !

In The Know wrote:
Anon wrote:
It is also notable that for the offence, which carries a maximum of 5 years, he wasgranted bail but could not provide a suitable address, forcing him to stay out his sentence.
To the O/P. Please be sure to leave your keys available to the homeless next time yougo on holiday.

It's notable that (in the original report) both the police and the complainant have shown "sympathy" for the offender.

Do you think that unreasonable?

Perhaps coming back from holiday and finding him dead on the doorstep (it was -10C!) would have been preferable?

A belated Happy Christmas, to you !
He could have sought shelter lawfully. An Englishman home should be (in theory) his castle and key theft and illegal entry should not be taken lightly. The man was rightly jailed for the theft and I hope the owners sue him for damages. You want to sanction this kind of behaviour, do it with your own home and let us know the results when you make your keys available to strangers.
It is strange that man eventually received his sustenance and covering , courtesy of her Maj. Should that not make your magnanimous heart leap since he is now out of danger from the cold?
I dread to ask but do you think such crimes should go unpunished and that persons going on holiday should give forfeit the right not to have their family houses illegally entered and taken over?

In The Know wrote:
Anon wrote:
It is also notable that for the offence, which carries a maximum of 5 years, he wasgranted bail but could not provide a suitable address, forcing him to stay out his sentence.
To the O/P. Please be sure to leave your keys available to the homeless next time yougo on holiday.

It's notable that (in the original report) both the police and the complainant have shown "sympathy" for the offender.

Do you think that unreasonable?
!
No it is not unreasonable. It is unreasonable to expect the sympathy to extend to condoning the crime. Fortunately the police sympathy did not extend to sanctionong the crime and he was prosecuted, apparently to your chagrin. Are you opposed to punishing those that steal keys and enter private property because they are cold? Do you think this practice should be allowed in law?

Anon wrote:
Are you opposed to punishing those that steal keys and enter private property because they are cold? Do you think this practice should be allowed in law?

I note that if the house had been left unlocked (or a window left open) then no crime would have been committed - as he would have been a squatter entering lawfully.

I find it very interesting that several posters show no sympathy whatsoever and would (apparently) see someone die in the cold rather than offering some kindness (esp at Christmas).

Perhaps Good Samaritans go on holiday at Christmas?

I think this is a sad reflection on our society. Not one of you has suggested alternatives (for example, a friend of mine is manning a Church hall every night till the end of January to give homeless people somewhere to shelter).

The campaign to abolish sanity! wrote:
He could have sought shelter lawfully.

Don't be so absurd !

He wouldn't be homeless if he had access to (or the means to obtain) shelter lawfully, would he?

In The Know wrote:
Anon wrote:
Are you opposed to punishing those that steal keys and enter private property because they are cold? Do you think this practice should be allowed in law?

I note that if the house had been left unlocked (or a window left open) then no crime would have been committed - as he would have been a squatter entering lawfully.

I find it very interesting that several posters show no sympathy whatsoever and would (apparently) see someone die in the cold rather than offering some kindness (esp at Christmas).

Perhaps Good Samaritans go on holiday at Christmas?

I think this is a sad reflection on our society. Not one of you has suggested alternatives (for example, a friend of mine is manning a Church hall every night till the end of January to give homeless people somewhere to shelter).

A crime would have been committed as he stole the house keys and that is ahy he was prosecuted, for theft, not squatting or illegal trespass. If I stole your bank card and used it just to see how much you have in your account would that be acceptable to you?
I do sympathize with his homelessness but I do not sympathize with or use it as an excuse for crime or perhaps you feel the homeless should be exempt from theft laws where they can show that they were cold or needy. You say the police showed sympathy yet it is the police that you castigated in your first post. What then is your beef?
The 'good Samaritan' parable is not appropriate here since that was a case of helping your neighbors practically and not winking at crime. Since you have invoked (misapplied) scripture, I will do the same. Ephesians 4:25 reads..."let the stealer steal no more". I fear that my reasoning may be falling on deaf ears since a number of my questions have gone unanswered. Perhaps, next time you go on holiday and arrive back home with your family and there is a complete stranger having made himself at home in your house, after the fear and trauma have dissipate, you may be able to view the issue objectively.
I bet my left nut that your first phone call will be to the police and that you would doubly secure your home and protect your keys from theft henceforth.

ITK, I agree with pretty much everything you say on this thread.

However, do I detect a whiff of inconsistency in your postings....? if this had been a British national would you not be calling them a scrounger?

I applaud your sentiments on this thread, but your attitude to people in vulnerable positions (such as myself) has been less than sympathetic in the past (and that's putting it mildly).

However, bravo for your comments here.

In The Know wrote:
The campaign to abolish sanity! wrote:
He could have sought shelter lawfully.

Don't be so absurd !

He wouldn't be homeless if he had access to (or the means to obtain) shelter lawfully, would he?
Never heard of homeless shelters? there is always an alternative to stealing and entering a persons home. You appear to think it an acceptable practice where there is hardship. Fortunately, common sense prevails in this case or do you think the law is wrong?

Innocent Accused wrote:
In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
The real sad part of the story to me is that this country is full of immigrants in the first place.I won't blame anyone for keeping warm,but is this any way to act in a foreign country? What a waste of his time,and our money.We were told the coalition was cracking down on immigration,for reasons like this I assumed,but sadly the EU makes it harder to do the sensible thing.

You currently "blame" the Poles.
Prior to this it was the West Indians, before that the Irish, and the Jews.

We have sent far more people to occupy other parts of the world (Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Rhodesia etc etc) than have ever come here !

When will you take some responsibility for your life .... instead of continually trying to blame someone else ?

And when will you stop being an egoistic prat?
If you need to lower yourself into getting personal then you have no place on this board.You've got no friends on here as it is,and you're hardly going about it the right way to improve the situation.

I feel a Sparticus moment coming on...