It seems that even Labour-leaning think tanks now realise what I've been saying all along !

www.express.co.uk/posts/view/267673

Interesting to note that in this tory supporting paper the majority of comments questioned where the jobs would come from.
I expect it sounds quite sensible,until you look at the logistics.Most unemployed in my area end up doing training in a charity shop,then simply sign back onto benefits after.

I'd love to see people in real jobs,but the problem is far more deep routed,and governments from Wilson on have failed to tackle employment and benefit reform,it will be no easy fix.

"guaranteed a job"...sounds OK to me.

"scroungers"...pornographer Richard Desmond at his worst.

...believe it when it happens.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2031014...unemployed-work.html

Seen it here in the mail,the majority of early comments also question where the jobs will come from.

Innocent Accused wrote:
also question where the jobs will come from.

I think the point is, that rather than pay people to do nothing - we should at least get something done if we create a job simply to employ someone.

It will get them into the work habit, and I bet the majority will go and find alternative jobs when they realise that simply staying in bed is no longer an option.

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
also question where the jobs will come from.

I think the point is, that rather than pay people to do nothing - we should at least get something done if we create a job simply to employ someone.

It will get them into the work habit, and I bet the majority will go and find alternative jobs when they realise that simply staying in bed is no longer an option.

Fair point ITK,but hardly a new one.Going back to the 80s/90s people were pushed into schemes,with removal of benefits for non compliance.
The downside of this is the cost,it's actually cheaper to pay for idleness than run a scheme.So value for money will only be achieved if there is a realistic chance of a job at the end.
it can only work in conjunction with other measures,like somehow limiting foreigners rights to work over here,but that is of course a different can of worms.
We could of course send them all over to Australia,on massage courses perhaps? where they could practice at veritas's palatial mansion

ah yes, the Daily Express, that bastion of excellent journalistic standards.

Have they stopped obsessing about Diana and the McCanns yet?

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
also question where the jobs will come from.

I think the point is, that rather than pay people to do nothing - we should at least get something done if we create a job simply to employ someone.

It will get them into the work habit, and I bet the majority will go and find alternative jobs when they realise that simply staying in bed is no longer an option.

we agree on some things..I have seen too many people..ex-junkies, long term unemployed..who have changed lifestyles, got a job and dignity and who never want to go backwards.

no-one, most especially the young who are full of energy , really wants to sit around do nothing. They go insane (and riot).

I guarantee this think tank is talking more of real jobs rather than punitive measures (that never works) and we are getting the tabloid version of their report.

However even the most right-wing PM Oz had from 1995 to 2008 announced and tried these 'scrounger' claims and tactics and they were all quietly dropped.

If the economy doesn't produce genuine jobs these schemes just do not work. And that can only happen by government creating huge infrastructure building schemes like FDR did in the USA..30's onwards which in turn stimulates private enterprise.

Now everything is privatised or 'globalised'. You cannot leave it to private business to create jobs as they operate in a vaccuum without caring for the rest of the economy.

Innocent Accused wrote:
The downside of this is the cost,it's actually cheaper to pay for idleness than run a scheme.

I dont think we are talking about training schemes here - its more about making the unemployed take menial jobs that need little training (cleaners, painters etc).

Once they get into the work habit they will soon start to look for better paid and more fulfilling positions (and as they have employment already will be able to show prospective employers that they can at least get out of bed on time !)

Innocent Accused wrote:
the majority of early comments also question where the jobs will come from.

The jobs will be those currently done by those from overseas - who flock here to take the jobs which the dole claimers say dont exist !

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
the majority of early comments also question where the jobs will come from.

The jobs will be those currently done by those from overseas - who flock here to take the jobs which the dole claimers say dont exist !

Ah ITK,employers always go for the best value for their dollar.
If you have a good for nothing product of the over strained british school system competing with a well schooled,experienced eastern european then it just won't happen.

The only way out of this vicious circle is to take control of immigration and employment practices.This of course means leaving the EU...a totally different argument.

Innocent Accused wrote:
Ah ITK,employers always go for the best value for their dollar.
If you have a good for nothing product of the over strained british school system competing with a well schooled,experienced eastern european then it just won't happen.

Not if there arent any jobs for the Europeans to go to - after the UK's layabouts have had their benefit cut !

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
Ah ITK,employers always go for the best value for their dollar.
If you have a good for nothing product of the over strained british school system competing with a well schooled,experienced eastern european then it just won't happen.

Not if there arent any jobs for the Europeans to go to - after the UK's layabouts have had their benefit cut !

while in the EU there will always be jobs going to cheaper and better foreigners,and at the same time their offspring will flood our school system,making our young idiots even more idiotic

A removal of benefit will never happen,and any scheme to force work on layabouts will get nowhere.Even thatcher stayed away from it,and can u really see the Libs supporting it?
This is the real world,and yes I would like to see something done,but based on the current political reality it won't happen.

Innocent Accused wrote:
A removal of benefit will never happen,and any scheme to force work on layabouts will get nowhere.Even thatcher stayed away from it,and can u really see the Libs supporting it?

Did you actually read the article?
It was a labour-leaning think-tank which has proposed the idea.

That Mr Millipede may talk loony - but even he knows that in reality the books need to be balanced, so while the loonies say one thing, they plan another (just like the cuts !) !

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
A removal of benefit will never happen,and any scheme to force work on layabouts will get nowhere.Even thatcher stayed away from it,and can u really see the Libs supporting it?

Did you actually read the article?
It was a labour-leaning think-tank which has proposed the idea.

That Mr Millipede may talk loony - but even he knows that in reality the books need to be balanced, so while the loonies say one thing, they plan another (just like the cuts !) !

Yes ITK,I did indeed read the article,and having an 'A' grade politics A level even understood the meaning.

This is a think tank pontificating on subjects long ago at the forefront of political debate.It won't work,and besides tough talk very little will be done on the matter.
I drink at a cafe around the corner from my local job centre,have the odd chat with the staff there.It is already the case that anyone refusing a job or suitable scheme can have benefit removed.The problem here is that you won't get the foreigners off benefit,and can u imagine the political backlash if Brits are forced off while newcomers to these shores continue to milk the system?

Again you have to look at it in balance,not in isolation,as it is indeed doing now.

Millibrat does indeed talk crap,but no worse than Camerloon,only a fool would believe a politician in the first place..and this report has certainly achieved it's real goal,publicity for some non entity of a think tank.

I've noticed over the past couple of years a worrying trend. Many of the 'young people' I know in their 20s are articulate, intelligent graduates. And yet they all mainly working in call centres (aka 'people farms') hoping that they will one day manage to get a job that is worth their education & capability. My advice to them has been: forget the "I want a job" mindset that they have been indoctrinated with and sit down - Think about what they would enjoy doing for a living and take steps to get there - else they will be trapped on this employment/unemployment hamster wheel until they are either 70, infirm or dead.
The 'underclass' don't stand a chance of mass employment because the 'proles' jobs are all being filled by the educated, people who would have traditionally forged real careers post-university. It's a shambles.

We accepted an underclass when Thatcher destroyed industry to control the power of the unions.

In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
the majority of early comments also question where the jobs will come from.

The jobs will be those currently done by those from overseas - who flock here to take the jobs which the dole claimers say dont exist !

the money Britain saves by not having to educate the far superior educated East Europeans is probably the equivalent of the dole so it all works out in the end.

despite it being a 'left leaning' think tank..saying everyone should have a job is just another motherhood statement..

as many have said..'what jobs'?

veritas wrote:
In The Know wrote:
Innocent Accused wrote:
the majority of early comments also question where the jobs will come from.

The jobs will be those currently done by those from overseas - who flock here to take the jobs which the dole claimers say dont exist !

the money Britain saves by not having to educate the far superior educated East Europeans is probably the equivalent of the dole so it all works out in the end.

despite it being a 'left leaning' think tank..saying everyone should have a job is just another motherhood statement..

as many have said..'what jobs'?

Part true of course,but it hardly appies to the warehousemen in Leics does it?
Immigration should be split into categories,useful and not,from there it's a pick 'n' mix stall
But remember,never blame a person for wanting to better themselves and their family,it's the governments fault they were allowed in,not theirs.

veritas wrote:
as many have said ..'what jobs'?

Should that be "as many (who dont want a job) have said ..'what jobs'"

It wont go away, veritas !!!!