One of Spain's largest banks has been part-nationalised as lenders continue to reel from the bursting of the property market bubble.
The state will take a 45% stake in Bankia, a lender which has the industry's largest exposure to toxic property assets.

The bank - Spain's fourth largest - was created only two years ago from a merger of seven struggling savings banks.

===

What happens when you dont pay your debts !

In The Know wrote:
One of Spain's largest banks has been part-nationalised as lenders continue to reel from the bursting of the property market bubble.
The state will take a 45% stake in Bankia, a lender which has the industry's largest exposure to toxic property assets.

The bank - Spain's fourth largest - was created only two years ago from a merger of seven struggling savings banks.

===

What happens when you dont pay your debts !

No ITK,this is what happens after you join the euro.
Without membership of the euro they would never have had the property boom,or be able to have borrowed so much to waste.
I know Spain very well,having actually been resident here when the euro came in.Things here can cost a lot more than at home,and the salaries are far lower to cover these costs.

This is the issue with Greece and France now. They want to say 'Stuff you' to austerity, but who are they going to go cap in hand to for all this spending money?

This is the problem with democracy. When asked most dim punters will simply answer "I don't care what you do as long as I don't lose any money". Doh.

JK2006 wrote:
This is the problem with democracy. When asked most dim punters will simply answer "I don't care what you do as long as I don't lose any money". Doh.

Absolutely spon on, JK.

Most electors should face an IQ test before being allowed to vote.

Who wants austerity? No one does. But without it HOW are you gonna pay for your previous overspend?

A - Elect someone who says we dont have to pay back the money - then see what happens LOL !

IA in Margate wrote:
No ITK,this is what happens after you join the euro.
Without membership of the euro they would never have had the property boom,or be able to have borrowed so much to waste.
I know Spain very well,having actually been resident here when the euro came in.Things here can cost a lot more than at home,and the salaries are far lower to cover these costs.

Nothing to do with the Euro ... some euro members have prospered very well.

ALOT to do with rampant inflation and borrowing on credit !!!

Foz wrote:
This is the issue with Greece and France

The small Democratic Left party will save the day in Greece and Hollande (in France) will come to his senses soon - when he realises that agreements made by the previous goverment are still binding.

In The Know wrote:
IA in Margate wrote:
No ITK,this is what happens after you join the euro.
Without membership of the euro they would never have had the property boom,or be able to have borrowed so much to waste.
I know Spain very well,having actually been resident here when the euro came in.Things here can cost a lot more than at home,and the salaries are far lower to cover these costs.

Nothing to do with the Euro ... some euro members have prospered very well.

ALOT to do with rampant inflation and borrowing on credit !!!

Actually ITK if you did some real research you'd find out that being in the Euro made it easier to borrow pre 2007.Those lesser economic entities were considered safer because the Germans et al guaranteed the euro,and in effect the only reason they have not gone bankrupt is precisely that.
The other thing of course is that of the varied economies of the euro,the Germans may need to try to control inflation with higher interest rates,while Spain needs them lowered to make its exports and tourism affordable.

IA in Margate wrote:
Germans et al guaranteed the euro,and in effect the only reason they have not gone bankrupt is precisely that

Sorry IA...that is rubbish.

The euro was not guaranteed by anyone.

IA in Margate wrote:
In The Know wrote:
ALOT to do with rampant inflation and borrowing on credit !!!

Actually ITK if you did some real research you'd find out that being in the Euro made it easier to borrow pre 2007.Those lesser economic entities were considered safer because the Germans et al guaranteed the euro,and in effect the only reason they have not gone bankrupt is precisely that.
The other thing of course is that of the varied economies of the euro,the Germans may need to try to control inflation with higher interest rates,while Spain needs them lowered to make its exports and tourism affordable.

Let's ask the BBC's Robert Peston (who seems to agree with me !!!! That the real problem is money borrowed that cant be paid back !!!! ) -

Will Spain suffer an Irish bust?

So why are Spain's savings banks in such a mess?

Well, the central bank, the Bank of Spain, has estimated - in its last Financial Stability Report - that Spanish banks are sitting on what it calls "troubled" property and construction loans of 184bn euros, equivalent to more than 17% of Spanish GDP.

Those loans are the poisonous legacy of a housing and construction boom that saw 5 million new homes built between 1997 and 2007, twice the increase in new Spanish households. Whole ghost towns were built.

Such is the dire quality of these loans that the banks are assuming they will ultimately get back only half or less of what they lent.

So it is possible that the banks are getting close to having properly recognised the scale of pain they face on this category of their lending.

However, they may not yet have made proper provision for likely losses on other categories of loan, notably residential mortgages, loans to small companies, and loans to highly indebted big companies.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18014073

Mart wrote:
IA in Margate wrote:
Germans et al guaranteed the euro,and in effect the only reason they have not gone bankrupt is precisely that

Sorry IA...that is rubbish.

The euro was not guaranteed by anyone.





There were no offical guaranties, but the banks - who lended all that money to Greece & Irland - acted like there was one.

There is a revealing scene in Michael Portillo's BBC 2 program about the Euro Crisis, when a German banker admitted this: "We were sure that in the end there would be a bail out".

Michael Portillo's Great Euro Crisis

The most astonishing fact about the program was this:

"Portillo trawled the two countries searching for someone who agreed with him that an economic seven-stone weakling like Greece should never have been allowed to join the eurozone and should now be expelled as quickly as possible. Whether it is a measure of his integrity as a presenter or his wrongheadedness as a politician that he found only one, I do not know."

From bankrupt Greece to resentful Germany: the travels of a charming Eurosceptic

In The Know wrote:
JK2006 wrote:
This is the problem with democracy. When asked most dim punters will simply answer "I don't care what you do as long as I don't lose any money". Doh.

Absolutely spon on, JK.

Most electors should face an IQ test before being allowed to vote.

Who wants austerity? No one does. But without it HOW are you gonna pay for your previous overspend?

A - Elect someone who says we dont have to pay back the money - then see what happens LOL !

The radio host James Whale suggests that those who wish to procreate should pass an exam first. He may have a point.

steveimp wrote:
those who wish to procreate should pass an exam first. He may have a point.

I've long advocated a birth control agent in the water supply !

Those who want to breed can sit an exam and if their IQ is high enough, will be given an antedote.

steveimp wrote:
those who wish to procreate should pass an exam first. He may have a point



How many points does he need?

petra wrote:
steveimp wrote:
those who wish to procreate should pass an exam first. He may have a point

How many points does he need?

Enough to show they can support themselves - and their offspring - whilest making SOME contribution to the society that will have to support them (and their offspring) should it be necessary.

DJones wrote:
Mart wrote:
IA in Margate wrote:
Germans et al guaranteed the euro,and in effect the only reason they have not gone bankrupt is precisely that

Sorry IA...that is rubbish.

The euro was not guaranteed by anyone.





There were no offical guaranties, but the banks - who lended all that money to Greece & Irland - acted like there was one.

There is a revealing scene in Michael Portillo's BBC 2 program about the Euro Crisis, when a German banker admitted this: "We were sure that in the end there would be a bail out".

Michael Portillo's Great Euro Crisis

The most astonishing fact about the program was this:

"Portillo trawled the two countries searching for someone who agreed with him that an economic seven-stone weakling like Greece should never have been allowed to join the eurozone and should now be expelled as quickly as possible. Whether it is a measure of his integrity as a presenter or his wrongheadedness as a politician that he found only one, I do not know."

From bankrupt Greece to resentful Germany: the travels of a charming Eurosceptic

True enough,add to that the bureaucratic creep and you have a failing state not taking the steps needed to get out of their problems.

I live in a Costa Brava resort,it's been losing tourists to cheaper non euro countries for years.Many friends here who have lost businesses because of excess government interfering have given up,and are going home.
If Spain went out of the euro the currency would devalue,these empty properties would become cheap enough,and richer Germans,French,Brits etc would find them more affordable.
On the other side I have friends here who remember how The Generalisimo made it so easy to open and operate businesses.My friend here lost his bar because his ceiling was deemed to be 12 cms too small! Foreign owned businesses especially are targeted by Mosas and Guardia police.
Spain did well from being in the eurozone at first,but can't adjust to the new reality since the 2004 expansion.

Spain's borrowing costs shot up at a bond auction today, after economic data confirmed the country is back in recession and reports of an outflow of deposits from nationalised Bankia hammered its share price.

uk.reuters.com/article/2012/05/17/uk-spa...dUKBRE84G0DC20120517

In The Know wrote:
Spain's borrowing costs shot up at a bond auction today, after economic data confirmed the country is back in recession and reports of an outflow of deposits from nationalised Bankia hammered its share price.

uk.reuters.com/article/2012/05/17/uk-spa...dUKBRE84G0DC20120517

Support here is waining fast for both the Euro and the EU.

Get your money OUT of the banks quickly, IA - before they go tits up !

In The Know wrote:
Get your money OUT of the banks quickly, IA - before they go tits up !

Rubbish - put it in a UK bank, guaranteed by the goverment.